What is renewable energy? Energy cannot be renewed. Only transferred from potential to useful work. You cannot run your engine in reverse and generate fuel.

And what to do when the sun doesn't shine and the wind doesn't blow? I have told you before. These sources of energy are practical for small endeavors such as households, but cannot power a city unless you have mega square miles of empty field adjacent to a city. And it cannot be stored. Only used as it is generated.

Using less energy. Now that is a viable concept. It requires a sacrifice from everyone, as solutions always do.

Can't we do both?

Yes.

Kevin aned Joe, we can certainly use less energy. The question is will we.

As for using the same amount of energy with alternate sources, solar and wind power are extremely limited. Ditto for bio-diesel and ethanol. Hydrogen fuel cells require gasoline to top $10 per gallon before they are cost competitive in automobiles. Landfill gas can generate a couple of megawattes; about enough to power five houses. Trash incinerators generate 50 megawatts and only use 5 but their has been a moratorium on them since 1993.

Hybrid Electric Vehicles are good, if you can afford one. They cost an extra $4,000. An alot of emissions are generated to construct the battery. You would be surprised.

The only viable technology we have that is reliable and can generate the amount of power we consume is nuclear fuel. But then the NIMBY effect kicks in.

Drive less and use less kilowatts at home will have a real effect.

Flavia and Greenies like her mean well.... but in test in Europe the Windmills operate at 17% of Capacity. The Days with winds less than 15 MPH and over 55 MPH make the generation turbines not Feasible unless at seaside this is not Financially Feasible.Even a Seaside Plant has 7 days a year with no wind.. The Power generated is 2-3 times more expensive... a Paralell system must be present and Maintained to handle these Peaks and Valleys where system is shutdown...
sounds Great but not the Prmary answer

France and Japan are always mentioned as standard setters for emissions but Greenies leave out the Morsel of fact that they run all residential on Nuclear and most commercial on Nuclear power in an Earthquake zone...

Can someone explain How Mars can be experiencing Global warming The Same time we are? Could it be the SUN Causing This?

Why Did Lief Erickson Abandon ICELAND when it was flooded from the polar cap Melting? How did it Happen?

So you say. Abundant, of-course. Storeable and transferrable. Hardly.

Solar panels can be used to heat homes and domestic water to a degree. It will barely put a dent in our energy demands.

I will say it again. The only answer to this problem is to lower our demands. It will require a sacrific, something we Americans loathe.

But please do let me know the day you see your gas or electric meter running backwards. That would be astonishing.

TODD Nuclear is the way to Go... see how the Green Movement ignore it! you can't have it both ways!Cutting demand goes only so far then you have less Jobs less income , More Taxes on down the Line..

You guys are looking at the too big a picture. These are just options at a local level.

If in fact this is a serious problem then eventually we all have to play our part, whether we like it or not.

Mike Collins is right. We have wasted years on our addiction to oil. When we look back and think of the different world we would have if someone in the federal government had taken the bull by the horns and truly addressed energy independence and renewable energy.

It is sad when we have to look to Brazil as an example of energy independence. The United States has always been the leader in technology for the past 200 years. The Brazilian government started their drive for energy independence in the 1970s. 80 percent of all cars sold in Brazil are "flex" engines -- engines that run on gasoline, alcohol, or a mixture of both fuels.

Why are we so far behind? The answer is simple. People have been apathetic to change, we've had a lack of leadership from our elected officials, and "big oil" has spent billions to ensure their marekt and profits continue to grow.

Just imagine how much better off we would be today if the 80s were the decade of energy independence instead of a decade of greed. Also imagine if we spent $400 billion on developing energy independence instead of fighting a war we cannot win.

President Carter could have kept prices over one dollar per gallon in the late 70's when OPEC saw the US getting serious about alternative fuel sources and plunged the price of crude from $40 to $14 per gallon. That would have kept the focus on development of alternative fuel sources. But he received more pressure than he could handle from Americans who were more concerned about the here and now. So he passed on the savings to us and that was the end of alternative fuel sources.

The reason we are so far behind is because we have paid so much less for gasoline than most people around the globe. Americans have to suffer and become convinced that the suffering will continue before they support change.

Kevin I agree with you about nuclear energy. 20% of our power comes from nuclear energy. 54% comes from coal. More nuclear power plants can be built and operated. But then you have the NIMBY effect. OK if we put the plant in your back yard? Don't mind it in mine, as long as the trucks do not run past my front yard and the landscaping is asthetic.

But more nuclear power plants still will not help getting cars from point A to point B.

Steve, what do you want to make ethanol from? I assume corn. This of course will raise food prices. Gas prices will stabilize but we will all pay more for food. Pick your poison.

You have more variables then equations. You need another equation to solve this problem. Your only solution is to lower demand. Americans seem to think that it is the government's responsibility to solve all of their problems. This problem is our and ours alone to solve.

And yes Kevin this will have a ripple effect on the economy. Consumer waste seems to be good for the economy on the short term. But we can withstand that by settling for what we need instead of everything that we think we want.

The Iraq war was won by the allied forces in 6 weeks. I do not know what to call what we are involved in now. It is not a war.

Prediction. We will never again see a time when the US military is not abundantly present in the middle east. The conflict started when the ayatollah rose in Iran in 1979 (I think is was 1979) and found a new level on September 11, 2001. As soon as we think we are out, we will be pulled back in.

$40 down to $14 per barrel (42 gallons), not per gallon.

The reason there hasn't been a new refinery is not because of the "environuts" as you so eloquently put it, but because of the oil companies. The more the produce, the lower the price goes.

Bio-diesel is the fastest growing industry. Projected to add 50,000 jobs, burns cleaner, and gets us off our dependence. A bi-partisan effort in Congress is happening to increase production via tax incentives, giving a $1.00 per gallon tax break and helping increase production 4 fold since its inception. Bio-diesel.

Thanks Gumbo.

After the bio-diesel production quadrouples, what percentage of our fuel consumption will it relieve?

Well right now, in just 2 years, there are 105 plants capable of producing 864 million gallons of domestic bio-diesel on a national scale. But let me be clear.

Bio-diesel is just one tool in the nation's overall move toward energy security. This is a bi-partisan effort with legislation being brought up and passed by members such as Blanch Lincoln, Norm Coleman, and Roy Blunt.

With the VEETC as an incentive within the Energy Policy Act of 2005, and the lawmakers ability to control the larger companies such as Tyson and ConocoPhillips from corrupting the process (see IRS rule number 2007-37), we will witness a paradigm shift in energy production here and a growth in the industry.

It won't replace foreign sources overnight, but it is an important, enviromentally friendly, and job creating cog of our energy industry, and our overall economy.

I know I sound kinda excited about it because I am. In a small rural town in Louisiana, there are actual jobs being created!! Being able to refine at 1.42 a gallon with the tax credit and compete! Being able to feed your kids and do a job that helps our security. That is a wonderful feeling. No, it doesn't mean we are off our oil addiction. It just means we begin to be. A new beginning. A step in the right direction.

Got it Gumbo. Happy to hear about the advances in Louisiana.

Now, 864 million gallons over what time period? A day or a year? If it is a day, that is significant. If it is a year, it doesn't even register a line on a pie chart.

Also, please know that the biodiesel from meat-bone-meal (MBM) process is dirtier than petroleum refinement and combustion of the product for moving transportation units puts out more pollutants per unit energy than the combustion of gasoline.

It is a year. But with the incentives in place there is another 1.7 billion gallons of capacity under construction.

To put this in perspective, right now we (the US) refines 1.8 billion gallons of diesel from Iraqi crude oil.

And not only that, but bio-diesel will add $24 billion to the US economy between 2005 and 2015, assuming BD growth reaches 650 million gallons of annual production by 2015.

Also, additional tax revenues from BD production will more than pay for the federal tax incentives provided to the industry. It will keep 13.6 billion dollars in America that would otherwise be spent on foreign oil.

And let me clear on this point. There is a term that needs to be embraced if we are going to make advances in energy security.

Its called "diversity of fuels".

Also, it is important to note that bio-diesel is not the same as "renewable diesel" that you had touched upon with the carcass to fuel process.

"Renewable diesel" is some oil companies attempt to feed off the tax-incentive (making yet another oil-company subsidy)

It is dirty!

The resulting fuel does not contain oygen, unlike cleaner-burning bio-diesel, and does not offer the same benefits of bio-diesel in terms of being non-toxic, biodegradable etc.

So in a nutshell BD adds to the distillate fuel pool (remember the diversity of fuels)
Adds to the US "refining" capacity
Utilizes agricultural products and
like I mentioned in a personal way, stimulates rural and urban economies and creates jobs.

"Renewable" diesel doesn't.

It sounds great and it should and probably will go forward. But it has to be economy driven. That is to state that if the cost of crude plunges 65% like it did in 1980, that will be the end of alternative fuel studies. Americans from all sides have proven time and again that they are only concerned with the here and now.

Now, let's take the high road. 1.7 billion gallons per year, or practically equal to what the US refines from Iraqi crude into conventional diesel. This would still seem to be at most a sliver of the pie.

Do you have any idea how much fuel the US refines and consumes every year? Just an order of magnitude? I do not but I suspect the number of gallons goes into the trillions.

The growth is exponential. You know the drill...would you rather have 1 million dollars now or take a penny and double it for X amount of days?

But it is clear that we need a "diversity of fuels". Bio-deisel will employ thousands. So will other forms. ConocoPhillips and Tyson foods know this and are taking steps to cash in. Follow the money. Bio-diesel is a winner, but a winner among many other winners.

It is a paradigm shift.

We concur. It should expand.

I was looking for a US fuel consumption rate to see what kind of impact 1.7 billion gallons per year can have. Any figures?

Sorry, have a life to get back to outside of this cyber one here. I have no idea what the impact is. I am just an enthusiastic citizen who did a little bit of homework. The NBB board website were I took most of the info is pretty comprehensive and has the info or someone that knows the info to give.

I have enjoyed our exchange. Onward and upward.

Todd