Deep Sixer

The last starting two guard this team had was shorter than Green and not as muscular. But he had a killer first step and crossover and took it to the bucket when his shot wasn't falling. He now plays in Denver. It's not a fair comparison of course, but I want to see Green break down a defender and go to the stripe instead of relying on a jumper with a defender's hand nearby.
Guards aren't like forwards and centers who need to play because of their size and sometimes in spite of limited talent. You shouldn't start in the NBA if every night is an adventure. That's what the bench is for. That's why I'm concerned about Green. When he's off he hurts the team more than he helps. At the same time he is the best starting option over Carney and Williams. Starting two is the position they should fill, and there should be some good options out there after the season is over. I do like Green but he needs to show more consistency, and one thing I've never seen from him is exactly that.

Willie Green can SHOOT and every once in a while gets hot, but he's not a SCORER...he has one of the worst points per shot in the league, he does not draw fouls and he doesn't look to the pass much...he's a poor (poverty stricken, living on the street sleeping in a box poor) mans allen iverson...he lacks the leadership, fire, passing ability, or ability to draw the foul...i have no idea how he AVOIDS fouls so well..but he seems to excel at NOT getting fouled

Marc, you are a lot more patient with Green than I would be. Green has had many chances to prove himself in the past, and he's NEVER shot better than 41% in a full season. Combine that with his poor 3-point shooting, poor free throw shooting (last year), and inability or unwillingness to get to the line (as evidenced by his ridiculous 7-to-1 FGA to FTA ratio), and he might be the worst starting 2-guard in the league. What good is it to be able to get your own shot if that shot is a jump shot that misses? On top of it all, he's a gunner when he's in the game, so he takes away shots from the better shooters. At least Carney at this point isn't a gunner. Right now, Green is the real weak link in the Sixers' lineup (last year, I thought he and Hunter were, and I've been pleased by Reggie Evans so far -- just the rebounder the Sixers needed). Anyhow, thanks for letting me vent, and keep up the good work with the blog!

Willie Green is a nice option off the bench if you want instant offense,and little D.Why Carney is'nt starting over Green probably has a lot to do with the fact that Mo Cheeks is trying to save his job,and in his mind,starting Willie Green gives him the best chance at winning.But I think by the midway point,Carney will be starting.

Everyone stop please. In my last response, I said that the Sixers' biggest offseason concern in 2008 will be to address the 2-guard position (Corey Maggette). Until then though, Willie Green is the best option with Louis Williams getting extended minutes as his backup. The worst thing would be to have Williams revert back to the "score first" mentality; he's nowhere near big enough to be a "2" in this league. He might get you 25-30 a game, but he'd give up 40 guarding guys like Ray Allen, Rip Hamilton, Kobe Bryant, etc. He'd get roasted. He has to develop into a legitimate "1" in order to prosper for this team down the road. Rodney Carney, the other popular choice, is not a consistent enough outside shooter and has zero handle at the current time. You need to have two legitimate ball-handlers on the floor at all times. A lineup of Miller, Carney, Iguadola, Evans, and Dalembert falls far short of that goal. For now, unfortunately, Willie Green is the best option at shooting guard.

Willie is not the problem, playing him for more than 20 min is. I wish the sixers can move smith to the three spot,move Iggy to the shooting guard spot, his natural position. That means miller, iggy , smith, evans and sam. This line up will cause alot of match problems and it can take the heat off of wille. How about playing thad at the three moving iggy to shooting guard spot, this way the rookie is surround by veteran players, and anything he does can contribute to the sixers, Ive seen thad, make steal, rebound , block shots, post up players, and defend, and score. they can use a multidimensional player on the floor. The only members on the sixers should play more than 40 is miller, and iggy, maybe korver. Willie, carney, and lou should not play more than 20 min!

While Willie may not be the answer at the two position, Lou or Carney may not be either. I'm pretty sure that part of what Cheeks is doing is still evaluating his talent because there is a pending trade/aquisition after this season that will probably involve one or maybe two of these players at the 2 position. Winning games now would be nice but knowing that Salmons was here not long ago has a haunting feel to it. Cheeks needs more time to see what he has to work with.

It's pretty clear that if Green is your starting two you're not going anywhere. This team still needs to be torn apart. They can't even begin to
think about moving in the right direction until they unload Dalembert and his contract. When Iggy is the third option on this team then the Sixers can begin thinking about a Championship. The best thing to happen to them is Iggy turning down his offer. I would have traded him last year. They have no one who can score in the post.

I believe that the players we can get for the 2 spot will all be reminescent of a ball-hogging player that the organization traded away to begin with. We truly need some inside presence more than a 2. We can build around a 5, or good 4, but 2's and 3's around the league can't get the job done as the epicenter of their team. We can more easily get a 2 or 3 than a 5 or 4.

Starting Smith at the 3 is an interesting idea. I don't know if he is quick enough to guard that position, but it's worth trying especially against weaker perimiter teams they could zone up. I love Thad but he is nowhere near ready. My real concern there is Iguodala. His shot looks better each year, but I really see him as a 3 more than a 2. I think about the players he's emulating, guys like Scottie and Grant Hill (NOT saying he is there yet!), and most of them played the 3 too. I also agree that the Sixers don't need to shell out a ton of money for a 2 in the off season. They need someone who can defend the perimiter and shoot from distance. It would be great if we could have someone like Raja Bell or Bruce Bowen on the roster. Oh wait...

"One thing Green has proven in the past is that he can score, especially in spurts."

If he takes 17 shots, he'll score 17 points. So will Eddie House. But Eddie House is a guy that signs year to year deals to be a bench player, but Willie Green is the starting 2 guard with a multi-year contract. Scoring points and scoring points efficiently are two different things.

"That brings us back to Green. While he hasn’t played well in the early going, he has proven in the past to be a competent scorer."

When? When has he proven to be a competent scorer? A hand full of games last year, maybe. But then do you just disregard the rest of the season where he proved to be one of the least efficient players in the NBA? It has been proven that wins are most related to offensive and defensive efficiency. Playing Willie Green will not lead to Sixers' wins.

Absolutely right... I couldn't have put it any better than that!

While I don't care for Iguodala at the 2, it seems like it might be necessary for the time being. Like someone else said, neither Green, Carney, nor Williams should be playing more than 20 minutes per game (though Williams should probably be playing the most out of that sad group). I'm in favor of trying Jason Smith at the 3. It would definitely create some match up problems... plus, it would keep him on the court and get him the experience he needs.

willie green is the least efficient option at the two spot. he should not be starting on a good team. luckily for him, the sixers are awful.

Lou Williams has played 45 minutes so far and has 8 assists to 1 turnover. While his shooting may be sporadic, he's scored 20 points over that span. Consistency should come with more playing time, don't you think? Not to mention that the Sixers have their best +/- stats with him on the floor...

I'm surprised that Willie Green is still on the team. Before the season I expected him to be traded, Carney would play the starting wing opposite Iggy and Young would get experience off the bench since the Sixers are rebuilding. Now i'm wondering how the heck Green beat out Carney for the starting job. If Carney (lottery pick)can't outplay Willie Green (second round,serious knee injury) then maybe he's the one that should go.

I believe Carney is the better wing option opposite Iguodala right now. With him, they improve defensively and get into transition more, which is good because the fastbreak is this roster's lifeblood right now. Plus, Carney's speed gets you cheap baskets, like the ones Iverson used to get by simply outrunning everybody down the floor. And Carney seems to move better w/o the ball than Green.

I think that the future Sixers lineup will have Miller/Williams at PG, Iguodala at 2/3, Carney/Thad at the 3, Smith at 4 and Sam at the 5.

This idea that Iguodala cannot be a 2 guard is just plain limited. He is a legitimate swingman, capable of playing stretches at the 1-4. More importantly, him at the 2 also gives him a better post-up option, since he is definitely stronger than most 2-guards in the league.

Willie Green is not this teams future at the 2. At best, he is a poor man's Microwave, only capable of a big run of points if that mid-range pullup is falling.

Maurice Cheeks is still in denial about how good his team is.He believes that Willie Green gives him the best chance at winning games,so he'll stick with him as his 2 until he realizes that the Sixers are going nowhere.By the midway point,Carney will be starting,and they'll(Sixers)be trying to trade Andre Miller,and Willie Green to get better cap space next year.

The Sixers should be in no hurry to make any decisions on personnel this season. They need to be sure of their analysis and move forward and not back and forth.

I love the blog Marc. I may have to start reading your articles as well as Jasner's.

Green is probably not the answer at the 2 spot. The key word being "probably." The last commentator made the best observation of all. The Sixers are in no position to make hasty personnel decisions. Green might not be an adequate starting 2 guard in this league but he has shown enough to be a consideration for significant playing time.

Carney has in no way shown that he is a better option. So far he has shown that he is the worst rebounder on the team and doesn't like to pass. Not exactly what I'd be looking for to give someone more minutes.

Now maybe he will grow into the position but again, the key word is "maybe". Williams on the other hand is a point and should not be considered as a starting 2. No doubt he can play the 2 but only in particular spots depending on matchups.

All in all Cheeks is doing what he has to, giving minutes to the players he thinks give him the best chance to win. It is easy for us to say Carney, Williams, whoever should play but its not our jobs that are on the line. I'm not saying Cheeks is the right coach for the Sixers but playing Green is not exactly proof he is doing a bad job.

Cheeks has to at least show he has a competivitive team. In the final analysis the Sixers might not have enough to be competitive but playing Green over Carney is the least of their worries.

There's not a single way to look at performance overall through 3 games and say willie green should play twice as many minutes as louis williams has already (100 minutes in 3 games versus 42 for Williams)

Any way you want to look at it, the sixers are better when williams is on the court and when green is off of it. There's no RATIONAL reason for williams not to be playing more (and conversely green play less)

Unless of course they are still stupid enough to believe that louis williams could be a point guard.

No question. Just because Lou Williams is the size of a point guard does NOT make him an NBA point guard. He's an undersized shooting guard with the potential to be a pretty good one if given the chance. And, as John just said, the Sixers are better when Williams is on the court and when Green is off of it. That's a fact.