Deep Sixer

man, this is a tough time to follow the sixers. it's hard to root against your team just to improve the ever-so-fickle lottery position but we sure as hell aren't going anywhere this year no matter how close the standings say they are now. i just wanna fast forward to the beginning of next season and wake up with gordon/mayo/bayless through the draft and smith/jamison through free agency and know that if the young talent comes together, we might just be a dangerous 5 or 6 seed by year's end.

"it’s hard to imagine that Atlanta will allow this restricted free agent-to-be to leave town"

Umm...no it's not. They pssed on signing Smith and Josh Childress last summer. Cost themselves a lot of money. too. I live in the ATL, go to Hawks games and read everything that comes from the Hawks franchise. Fact: Al Horford is the new face of this franchise and HE WANTS TO PLAY POWER FORWARD! Billy Knight staked his reputation on drafting Marvin Williams over Chris Paul and Deron Williams.
If Billy Knight is GM for next year, Marvin starts at the 3 and Horford at the 4.

Josh Smith could play the 3, if Billy Knight were let go, then they would trade Marvin Williams. And this is very possible. The Hawks have a very screwy owneship situation, and the president of the Atlanta Spirit (they own both the Hawks and Thrasher) Bernie Mullen, was just let canned. So now the GM's of both the Hawks and Thrashers report directly to the seven guys who own both teams. That's never a good thing. Oh yeah, and one of the seven owners is suing the other six in an ugly dispute.

The Hawks HAD A CHANCE to re-sign Josh Smith last summer, and passed. Even though he's a local ATL guy. Even though he spent his summer working out in Houston with Hakeem Olajuwon. But Smith has had multiple run-in's with Mike Woodson over his career with the Hawks. But he is maturing, and his game is evolving. And he's got heart on the court. Also does some charity work around town, but he's fairly humble about it. You'll see him around at a high school game or even a kids rec league game.

If Billy Knight stays, Josh Smith will be available in a sign & trade. Billy Knight has stated multiple times he loves Dalembert. he loves centers who can both block shots and run, since the Hawks have some flyers like Childress and Marvin.

If Billy Knight is fired, which is possible, then the Hawks ownership may keep Smith and trade Marvin Williams.

The Hawks are not happy at all with their point guard situation. Speedy Claxton was a horrible signing. They get some from Anthony Johnson and Ty Lue but not much. They like Acie Law, but he had an injury and has really regressed since. Guessing the owners will never forget they could have had Chris Paul, or Deron Williams. Put Chris Paul with Childress, Joe Johnson and Josh Smith, and you have Phoenix East. And you'd be selling tickets. The Hawks do not sell tickets unless Kobe or Lebron are in town.

But again, Al Horford is the glory boy in the entire ATL these days, and he will be starting at 4 next season for the Hawks. Take that to the bank. Josh Smith will be available, and would look nice in a 6ers uni. I could live with pg Miller, sg Iggy, sf Thad, pf Josh Smith and a decent center, maybe Jason Smith but prefer Jason off the pine. Sweet Lou as a como guard off the bench, Reggie Evans providing some boards and sparks at the 4, but you would definitely need another center and something more at sf unless Carney eventually develops.

Back to the point, Josh Smith will be available (if Billy Knight isn't fired).

Seeing how he affects a game down the defensive end, I wonder if E.S. would think about using Sam in a trade for Josh. The benefit for Atlanta is Horford moves to the 4 , but more importantly, they would save about 6 to 8 million of cap space to use on another player if he wants max money. From what I understand, since the Korver trade we could trade Sam!s contract [11 mill. next year] for Josh at the max [16 to 18 mill.] because we will be under the cap.

First of all, as a long-time 76ers fan, it kind of angers me to see what Billy King and Ed Snider has let this franchise come to. This team just doesn't have enough talent right now to compete and win.

This game against the Hawks was a perfect microcosm of why the 76ers need to trade Andre Miller for the future of this franchise. When the 76ers went to their bench tonight, they had nothing. One fourth of the team aren't even legit NBA players. Ollie, Shavlik, Lou Amundson and Booth shouldn't even be in the league.

Now on to this game. Josh Smith showed you why he could be a very important piece to this team. He is one of the few players in the NBA that can impact the game at BOTH ends of the floor, and he is only 22 years old to boot. The 76ers have to trade A. Miller for expiring contracts and a young player or a draft pick to have a shot at Josh Smith.

Is Josh Smith the back to the basket 4 that everyone on this board wants? No, not right now he isn't. His jumper needs work to. However, I think a starting 5 of Josh Smith, Dalembert, Thaddeus, Iggy and Lou Will wouldn't be a bad start. Josh Smith impacts the game on BOTH ends of the floor.

For those of you who saw the number of empty seats at the Phillips Arena plus know the history of the Hawks ownership situation, do you think that management would match a 5-year deal for Josh Smith at about $15M per year, making him the highest paid Hawk in history? I don't necessarily think so. The Hawks future at both forward spots are Marvin Williams and Al Horford with Joe Johnson at 2-guard.

Stefanski said he'd like to have a young player in a deal for Miller, so how about Miller for a Hawks package of Acie Law (future starting PG, $1.9M), Pachulia or Sheldon Williams (serviceable PFs, I like Pachulia better than Williams and his $4M salary) and Tyrone Lue (expiring $3.5M salary) or Lorenzon Wright (expiring $3.2M salary).

A future starter in Law, a serviceable PF in Pachulia and an expiring contract or contracts in Lue and Lorenzon Wright. Anthony Johnson also has an expiring $2.86M contract, so I'd also offer them Willie Green or Reggie Evans along with Miller in a package. Here you have the young player and expiring contracts plus a legitimate need by the other team to do something.

It sucks to know that every team in the NBA has more talent than the 76ers every night. Even the Grizzlies have more legitimate NBA players than the 76ers. C. Booth, Shavlik, Ollie and Amundson really shouldn't even be in the league, and that is about a fourth of this team. Stefanski's first job is to try to get a legitimate TEAM of NBA talented players. His best option to achieve that is by trading Miller.

A. Miller's trade value is at its highest because he can help a team like the Hawks make the playoffs or a team like the Cavaliers return to the Eastern Conference finals. I don't buy that this team needs Miller to develop the youngsters. This team is terrible WITH Miller. I think Thaddeus and Jason Smith have to take it upon themselves to work on their games to the point that they become great players. That isn't Andre Miller's responsibility. That is management's and the individual player's responsiblity.

Here we are just wanting a team that can compete enough to make the playoffs and then the Lakers, an already stacked team, go pull a deal and get one of the few 20 and 10 guys in the NBA for peanuts. It is extremely frustrating.

Sixteen days to the NBA trading deadline. Let's see what Stefanski can do.

I think one of the major problems is that there really isn't a market for Andre Miller. It will be extremely difficult to trade him for a combination of expiring contracts equal to his salary, if not impossible. I feel if this option had been available that Stefanski would have executed.

Go through ESPN's trade machine and see what you can come up with, but I don't see why Atlanta would trade Acie Law ( a lottery pick in last year's draft ) plus Pachulia/Williams plus expiring contracts to the Sixers for Miller. I think that is being a little idealistic, and if that trade were available at the moment, I feel like Stefanski would have taken it.

BoomDizzle,

Stefanski knows that he probably won't receive the best deal for A. Miller until the trade deadline day. I think the Hawks and Magic could be interested in A. Miller. Let's see what Ed can come up with. I don't think $10M to $12M will be enough to make any noise this summer.

Dear Ed,

Please get Josh Smith!

Do what you need to do. be as creative as you need to be. Get Josh Smith while holding on to Sammy and you will have a packed house every night. Think about the future of the franchise, Ed.

We will be running teams out of the gym for years. The team will be entertaining and all of the core will be young enough to give you the chips you need to get us a title. The back to the basket 4 may just be a thing of the past. Think big, Ed. We are counting on you.

I still like my trade proposal..not perfect, but I think has a chance.

Andre Miller and Jason Smith for Josh Smith and Claxton's bad contract.

ATL gets a veteran PG that they can either keep or just have him groom Law for a year and have a great chip at next year's trade deadline; plus a player that can allow Horford to play some 4; plus get rid of a bad contract.

Sixers get an all star potential, athletic 4 without trading Sam or Iguodala.

Would prefer not to take back Claxton's contract, but Ollie drops off this year.

Sam and him would be great together, but you have to be realistic.They own his rights ,they will not give him away. If we get him,for Sam, then we can get a center that can play in the low post in the draft [ Hibbert,Lopez, D.Jordan]. Having all jumpshooting athletes is fun to watch, but come playoff time , somebody has to be able to post up.That is why who we draft may give us more of an idea of E.S.!s gameplan.

John, after watching last nights game, I doubt the Hawks do that. His value, like A.Millers , will be greater over the summer. If Pheonix loses again, Memphis[ M.Miller,Lowry, etc.],Sacramento [Bibby, Artest], there will be many bidders.

I didn't get to see the game but the +/- stats for LouWill and Carney were telling -19 and -10 respectively. Is LouWill that much of a defensive liability? It seems like once the starters came out, the Hawks ran roughshod.

Does anyone know what Josh Smith was looking for money-wise this previous summer? More than Iguodala? I would definitely like to see him in a Sixers uniform. Here is just a random trade.
Andre Miller, Jason Smith/Rodney Carney, Utah's future #1 for Josh Smith, Tyronn Lue, and Lorenzen Wright.

The only way I see the 76ers prying him away from Atlanta is if they front load a contract. Starting at about $17m in the first year and decreasing every year of the deal. Would come out to about $71.7M. Problem is that Atlanta still can match anything we throw at Smith.

Not completely sold, although last night was pretty impressive. From what I understand down Atlanta way, he can't guard big 4's or stay in front of mobile 3's. I'd be interested to know how he does going up against Zack Randolph or someone similar.

This is an article I found from Oct. Gives a little glimpse of where they stood on salary.

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/10/24/hawks-spurn-josh-smith/

Every time I envision a trade for A.Miller the team that fits the best is the Bulls. We know what a glue guy Dre is, we have seen it here. E.S. has said cap room is not as important as getting young players back.On the Bulls side, they need a player that a] gets to the basket; b]is big enough to cover 2 guards when Gordon is on the floor; c] can post up [our best post player ]; and finally a glue guy , they are not a good TEAM!!! T.Thomas [dnp], saw this again last night; Pass first , defensive pointguard [DEAN], C.Duhon; big p.g. to play next to L.Williams off the bench, T.Sefalosa.This trade makes too much sense; from the Sixers side, if Duhon does not show you enough the rest off this year, than let him go [3.5] off the cap.From the Bulls side, they may want more [Carney, Green, Utah #1,or a future pick]. T.Thomas is a very interesting player. He seems to get a lot of bl.shots and steals per minutes played. Bulls are loaded up front, he just can!t get time. E.S., this trade would fill some ofr our needs, but still keep our options open on draft night.

If Smith wants around 65 million dollars, would we still be able to re-sign Iggy at about 55 million?

Craig, He was coming off of the weak side to block a lot of shots - much like Ratliff did when he was here. Nobody plays man to man anymore anyway. Ratlitff wasn't known as much of a straight up defender but he blocked a TON of shots coming from the weakside and that springs the fast break, especially if he can learn to keep those blocks in play. This guy and Brand have to be Ed's targets in the off-season. I think Smith sells more tickets which will put him ahead of Brand on the Sixers' list. They will probably wait to move Miller, unless they get a really good offer.

Craig, good article. Wonder about the character issues. They were there in high school, draft night and even now. To give a max contract [16 to 18 mill. ] you take a big risk.V.Carter, T.Mcgrady, Z.Randolph [all risks]

Talk about scary freak athleticism...Iguodala, Young and Josh Smith running the court for 48 minutes would be imposing for any team to deal with. Could Smith develop the needed post game? Sure, he's only 22. I'd have no problem taking a chance on him.

After that game though it's tough to see how they ATL would let a guy with that much potential go. I don't care who got drafted #2 over CP3.

Lastly, Thad Young needs to get more aggressive. I don't like layups when he can dunk a ball. He's got ups, let the fans see them. I'd like to see him get nastier.

A few games ago I saw Josh Smith go heads up on Shawn Marion. He put the ball through his legs twice, jukes him but could not get by. Instead of passing back out and running a play, he took a fade away 18 foot jumper from the wing. CLANG!!! Just what we need. He is not a max contract guy.

If the Sixers can somehow pry Josh Smith away from the Hawks, it still does not address a huge problem for the sixers. THe Sixers are not a bad team when they swat shots, rebound, get hands and finger tips on the ball and run back the other way, but when the opposing team drops back into a zone... scary music... game over. After last night's game do you think anyone will ever play the Sixers man-to-man? We need a low-post scorer and a fricking shooter. And I'm not whining about losing Korver. Calderon, Hinrich, Mike Miller. Guys that teams aren't giving away but might be available with a little creativity and cap space - E.S.

Iggy probably gets [5yrs, 60 mill. ] Smith [5 yrs, 70 mill.] Actually think Randolph and Brand are better fits than Jamison and Smith, come playoff time, and thats what it is all about, we can!t have five jump shooters on the court.The fast break is not always there; ask Pheonix.If we move Sam for a low post scoring center than it could work.

To say no one plays man to man anymore is an indictment of where the league is. That's a shame because you are possibly correct in the assessment.

Suede, to be honest with you, I cringe just thinking of the type of money to give someone with a limited offensive game. Although the offer I proposed only (HA...only - too funny) comes out to about $14.5m per year.

This is where Miller comes into play, and datruth, it might have to wait until the offseason. Miller will be worth more as an expiring contract than as a player. At the trade deadline, people are looking more for players. In the summer, his expiring contract will be in play to get a Smith type player in a sign and trade, or straight trade.

I love the idea of Smith, I do not love the idea of trading Sammy to get him. Miller + anyone on our roster besides Sammy, AI, Lou and Thad.
/Morty
Morty and Moishe Recommend...

Morty, if we can get Smith without trading Sam, then Iggy or Smith will have to become a 22 to 25 pt. per game scorer. I!m not sure either is. There will be no money left to add that player.

Here's my opinion.

If you keep Sam, you go get Brand.

Since the only viable C on the market is now off to LA (Gasol), this probably needs to be option. If you trade Sam in a package to the Hawks for a Josh Smith sign-and-trade deal, what are you going to do about the C position? Even though by trading Miller you'll have a sh*tload of cap room, there are no viable Centers out there next year, either in the draft or free agency. And, the Sixers need to address the SG position in this year's draft.

No, I think you trade Miller, bowl over Brand with a "can't refuse it" offer, and go get Gordon or Mayo in the draft.

And, to those out there who said that the Sixers are capable of making a run the rest of this season without Andre Miller...have you been watching this team lately? Without Andre Miller, this team would lose every game by 20+ pts. He's the only reason that they have anything resembling an offense. If they dump Andre Miller, they'll be LUCKY to win 10 games max the rest of the season.

Denver needs Andre Miller. The Nuggets' current PG options are Anthony Carter and Chucky Atkins. They did not break the bank to pair Iverson and Carmelo just to lose in the 1st round of the playoffs every year (although, they clearly are getting more content driven TV / Internet $$). THEY NEED ANDRE MILLER, GEORGE KARL LOVES ANDRE MILLER.

Trade Andre Miller to the Nuggets for Eduardo Najera (expiring), JR Smith (expiring), and Steven Hunter (can be your backup C for the next 3 years at $3M per season).

Ed Stefanksi - do this deal. It clears the way for everything else to fall into place. PLEASE DO THIS DEAL FOR ALL OF OUR SAKES!!!

We talk about becoming Pheonix of the east.If Smith is our 4, Thad our 3, and Iggy our 2, we would need a NASH at the point, and a AMARE type low post threat at the 5. And PHEONIX hasn!t won yet. I would rather get a low post conventional 4, let THAD be our 4 when we want to run, and add some pure shooters. Having 2 good shot blockers is nice, but would the Sixers of A.I. #1, have been better defensively with Theo and Catchings together or Theo and Hill. we need a physical , low post four.

suede:

How do you figure? Miller + say, Green or Evans or Carney for Smith is an even swap of salary, and we still have the existing 10 mil of cap space.

Because Miller is expiring I don't really see a deal where we get back expiring contracts in exchange for him. That's not the NBA works. You trade players with longer term contracts for expiring contracts to get out form under salary.

Dean's scenario with Denver one of the few ways we could pull that off - a contender who needs Miller. But those teams are limited.
/morty

Dean, I liked your trade offer and could see it working for both sides, but Hunter can't be traded back to the Sixers until the offseason. Try again.

please stop talking about elton brand. love him as a player and i loved him as a fit here (before he tore his achilles...a tough injury to come back from) but the guy is going to make more money in LA next year than he can get anywhere else. why would he opt out of his larger contract to move across the country and play for the powerhouse that is the philadelphia 76ers.

please stop talking about elton brand. love him as a player and i loved him as a fit here (before he tore his achilles...a tough injury to come back from) but the guy is going to make more money in LA next year than he can get anywhere else. why would he opt out of his larger contract to move across the country and play for the powerhouse that is the philadelphia 76ers.

Dean, Hunter can!t be traded back to the Sixers [tr. restr.]. Denver is a tough matchup trade wise for us,unless you like Nene. Would you do the Bulls trade.Thomas only makes [3 to4 mill. ]? If he works out ,great. If not, your not paying him 16 to18 mill.

Fine, throw in Von Wafer or Diawara instead. It gets you to the same end; also, I'm sure the Sixers could re-acquire Hunter after the season if they really wanted him.

Morty, if you can get Smith for that stuff, Ill drive them to Atlanta.

Dean, that's a valid point, but you can get by in this league with just a serviceable center. The Celt's have Kendrick Perkins. The Pacers have Jeff Foster. If you have a stud at the 4, you can get by a decent veteran at the 5. Jason Smith will be a nice 4/5 off the bench for years, but yes, the 6ers would have to get a vet center starter. Even old man Kurt Thomas would suffice for a year. At least you know he would knock down and intimidate all those point guards that blow by Dre Miller each and every game. They don't fear Sammy. Someone like Thomas or Nick Collison would actually put the fear of being hammered in their mind.

I agree, if you keep Sammy, Elton Brand is the way to go. If you trade Sammy for Josh Smith, the Hawks would have to throw in Zaza Pachulia, who have seven boards and seven pts. in only 20 minutes last night. You cna get by for a year or two with a guy like Zaza, who has
an easy contract to take on. It may take Sammy and the Utah first rounder from the Korver trade, but I've said this before, Horford is the Hawks' 4 for the next 10 years, and the Hawks GM loves Sammy.

And we still really, really need at least one guard who can defend both 1's and 2's...Charlie Bell, Jarret Jack, Kelenna Azubuike, Yakhouba Diawara. Anyone of those guys would be nice paired up with Sweet Lou. Remember how nice it was a few years back when Aaron McKie was the lock down guy, and even Eric Snow was tough on oposing point's. We need a pit bull to defend the perimeter.

also a pet peeve of mine that i see all too often. there is no A.I. #1 because there is no A.I. #2, just like there's only one L.T.

Nick - Elton Brand is guaranteed $15M from the Clips for one more season. After that, he's an unrestricted free agent. Coming off an injury, why would he not strongly consider a $75M / 5 yr deal? You're saying that he would laugh at $60M extra guaranteed? You're wrong there sir.

trackboy, i'm not a g.m. but i swear i remember hearing that brand can't make as much money anywhere next year as he can with the clips

TrackBoy - I agree with you 100% re: Brand vs. Smith and everything that's involved.

Imagine if you could trade Sam, a 2009 #1, Jason Smith, and Willie Green for Josh Smith and Zaza Pachulia. You might not have to even include the #1, but I would if necessary.

And, assuming you have the cap space after moving Miller, you could max out a guy Calderon or Monta Ellis AND still get Gordon or Mayo in the draft because the team would still tank without Miller the rest of this season.

Man, there are some good options here. Miller must be moved though.

and dean, maybe it works out and as i've said i love elton brand but even if you're right about the money thing thats a big chance to take on a player who is getting older and coming off a serious injury.....think long and hard about that one

Jumpin' - You don't get the max for the minimum in the NBA. It's pay big (and risk) in order to play with the biggies. A 22 year old '9 blocks, jet-fueled' forward has to be a consideration, if available. And your conclusion is drawn from one bad decision and one clanged shot??

Wow! - J. Smith's one-step, straight up climb to swat Young's shot at its peak. While marveling at his talent, my question is: how consistent is his play; was last night an anomaly?

Miller is scoring but is being given a free reign to do it. I don't want a PG leading team in scoring often. If Cheeks gave the same kind of green light to SG Green, he too could put points on board. I can't see why people are ga-ga over Miller and think he's an important component to a team under reconstruction (18-30), especially knowing his deficiencies on other end. Market value - time to use it.

Sixers need someone to distribute, play hounding D, keep 'em honest with occasional J--like their head coach in his prime. Hard to find, but a true need. Calderon does 2 of 3 well.

Nick, allthese guys want to win. Garnett got tired of having to go thru the west to get to the finals.Now you add Portland and NewOrleans to that list. If the Sixers get lucky on draft night and come away with Rose, Gordon etc., then Brand may see himself as the last piece.

i've heard there's all kinds of interest in calderon but toronto will do whatever it takes to keep him. any one else hear the same thing because he would be a fine addition if miller's traded.

Calderon is unrestricted, if we have more cap room we could outbid them, unless they want to pay luxury tax.

I love the idea of Tyrus Thomas. 6'10 freak athlete with nothing but upside? Done. I'll pick him up from the airport, you guys wait at the stadium with the welcome banner.

The more I think about it, the less Josh Smith appeals to me. How many wing players do we really need? And I'd much rather see Smith at the 3 than the 4. Yes, he bullied Thad Young last night, but do you think he can do the same to the likes of Duncan or Garnett or Wallace?

So to sum up, I've changed my vote. Let's make this Tyrus Thomas myth a reality. Thomas and Sefalosha for Miller and Carney.

Well said Theo, by the way, you were my daughters favorite player.

First of all, I think everyone should pretty much forget Calderon. He is the perfect point for Toronto and I don't see Colangelo letting him go.

Second, Kendrick Perkins is paired with three superstars and Jeff Foster plays for the Pacers who are terrible, so I don't see them as being too great examples on how a "serviceable" center is all that is required. Josh Smith is no Garnett.

Here's a name I haven't seen mentioned: Andris Biedrins. He is a restricted free agent this summer and could be a good addition for a decent salary. If we moved Dalembert I would feel good about having Biedrins as a replacement, if possible. What do people think?

If Gold. St. loses again Nelson may ask Mullin to upgrade the 5 spot.Nelson doesn!t have many years left. Sammy and 2009 #1 for Biedrens [s. and tr.] and B.Wright?

How do we suppose the 76ers get to offer Brand this $75M? Anybody ever hear of tampering? HE'S UNDER CONTRACT WITH ANOTHER TEAM! Dean, you seem to skip over that part. Pesky thing, those rules and all.

It's not about what Brand would do. Who would turn down that kind of money? It's about what makes sense for this team. Talking a about offering $75 Million OVER 5 YEARS to a guy who has not played a minute this season because of suffering a horrible injury, who's already missed over half the season and will probably not be back until next month (maybe later), is nuts to me...NUTS, I say!!!

Biedrins is another offensive rebounding machine that would fit in fine at the 4 here. Is he the post presence we need? Probably not. Can he develop? Sure. Is he Tyrus Thomas? No.

My point is let's get Tyrus Thomas already.

That would be awesome if they could get Smith. It seems like ATL is overloaded with forwards who are pretty much the same size Smith, Childress, Williams and now Horford wants to play forward according to Trackboy. It seems like Horford is alright at center and they'd be better off trying to add a point guard. They seem to have all the other parts in place. They could be a contender to win the east if they kept Horford at C and traded one of their forwards for a PG. This is just my speculation but I don't see why the Sixers couldn't swing a deal based off Andre Miller and Josh Smith.

Andre Miller
Jason Smith
Louis Williams
Calvin Booth

for

Josh Smith
Tyronn Lue
Anthony Johnson
Lorenzen Wright

The deal works salary wise. The Sixers get Smith at PF and 3 expiring contracts. PG will be makeshift for the rest of the season but there are plenty in the draft. Sammy, Smith, Thaddeus, Iggy is a pretty solid 4. Just need a point guard.

Atl would be pretty good. Horford, Marvin, Childress, Joe Johnson and Miller. Nice lineup with Jason Smith, Lou, Pachulia and Acie coming off their bench.

thank you for restoring sanity craig. and also thanks for clearing up the contract thing for me........its not that no one can offer brand more money, its that he'd have to opt out of his 15 mil and hope something better is out there

Craig, Brand is going to have to come back as soon as possible to show teams he is healthy.After the draft [Ithink] is when players reup. If he plays well at the end of the year,then he is the perfect fit. Smith has a lot of issues. If not, I think he!d be signed.

As far as Tyrus Thomas I would love to have him here but would Chicago really give him up?? I would also like Duncan Nowitzki and Deron. Chicago already has 2 PGs so Miller is no use to them. They have plenty of Forwards and have Wallace at C. None of the Sixers players would have any value to the Bulls. I doubt they would let Thomas leave in free agency either.

I know Shaggy Williams would take a 10 day contract. He would take anything that was thrown at him. Including an egg at his head.

Nick / Craig - I think you guys are a little naive if you don't think the Sixers (or another team) will send out a feeler through one of its players to gauge Brand's interest. You think that Elton Brand won't take a call from Andre Iguodala "as a friend" before he has to exercise the option on his deal? Or if one of the Sixers' players is reprensented by Brand's agent? It happens CONSTANTLY in every professional sport.

Do you think that inside information isn't passed in the investment community because there are laws against it? Christ, it was reported on CNBC today that the January manufacturing data was leaked 75 minutes before it was to be released nationally. The stock market tanked for no reason at around 8:45 this morning, and the data had to be released early.

This kind of stuff happens in EVERY industry guys - wake up.

Miller is unique in that he can play next to Hinrich and Gordon.Chicago needs a floor general, Hinrich is as much a 2 as a 1. Jared, I think Miller is exactly what the Bulls need.As far as Thomas, they have too many players locked in to untradeble contracts [Wallace,Nucioni,J.Smith] to get him on the court.Plus, Noah is ahead of him. If we could get Noah, that would be better, but that is not going to happen.

I'm sorry but I just don't see Stefanski being our saving grace this season or next.

Thanks, Craig. Im glad at least one other person realizes that we can't make an offer to brand until he opts out. Yes, Calderon is going to be in demand BUT AT LEAST WE CAN MAKE HIM AN OFFER. You can't just call up a guy's agent who is under contract and offer him a deal. he needs to opt out first.

And if he does opt out, im seeing that as a red flag. That sounds like that action of a guy who's doesn't want GMs to get too good of a look at him before he signs a deal. He knows quite well that if he's healthy and plays out next year productively, he'll command much greater value since teams will know he's healthy, plus the new contract would then be starting a year later and presumably last a year longer. If he does opt out, the thought has to be that he's not sure he'll live up to expectations and wants to get the new deal locked up before anyone sees that he's not completely healthy.

Dean, I'm wide awake.

Oh, ok. So Dala, who's trying to earn a max deal himself, is going to ring Brand and say "I think Ed would be interested in you for 5 years $75 Mill. What would you think of that?" Doubt that would happen, but you feel free to do so. I know GM's and agents talk all the time on and off the record. But if an agent is wrong about the number, if the player opts out and the courting team gets cold feet, what happens then? The player has no recourse. Way risky, but I'm sure you're right about all of this. I'll await Brands arrival.

Mr. Boras, Mr. A-Rod would like to have a word with you.

suede:

Why isn't that a good deal for ATL? The Sonic only got a 2nd round pick in the sign and trade with Rashard Lewis last summer. ATL gets 10 mil in cap room, that's a really big number, especially because they will have o extend a bunch of their young guys in the next few years.
/ Morty

KM--very astute observation about the red flag theory, i wouldn't have thought of that but it makes alot of sense. this is why message boards can be informative when you don't get idiots talking about shaggy williams on them

Craig:

agreed that a Calderon or Smith is more feasible than Brand.
/Morty

As a die-hard Hawks fan and a 10-year season ticket holder, I can assure you that Josh Smith will NOT be traded for any package where the Hawks' primary return would be Dalembert or Miller. In fact, the Hawks wouldn't trade Smith for a package that included Dalembert AND Miller. Miller would be great short-term for the Hawks but only if playing WITH Smith, not in place of him. Same goes for Dalembert.

Trackboy1 is WAY off base when he calls Horford the "face of the franchise." Al is a terrific young rookie with a lot of upside but he is a lot like Joe Johnson in that he doesn't bring that "wow factor" to the game. Josh Smith is WITHOUT QUESTION the player that most Hawks' fans come to see and he (along with Joe Johnson) is the guy that the team markets.

Philly's only hope of acquiring Smith would be to outbid the Hawks for his services by offering him a max contract that the Hawks didn't want to match but I will be shocked if they don't match any offer he gets. The one thing that matching a max offer to Smith MIGHT do is allow another team to outbid the Hawks for the services of Josh Childress.

Morty, I agree with making an attempt at Calderon, but I can't take credit for bringing his name up here today. You might be referring to another poster. Thanks.

Let's address something here seriously.

What makes you think Tyrus Thomas can't be had via trade? Has Chicago never gone out there and reached to make deals? Is he dropping 20-10 a night? He's losing minutes at this point to Ben Wallace and Noah for chrissakes?

That being said, I think Chicago would more than listen to a Miller/Thomas deal. Hinrich is terrible at the point. They need a floor general. If Chicago thinks it can turn the season around with Miller, they do that deal easily. Especially if they reach out and make the reported McGrady for Gordon deal. It's not as far-fetched as it might sound.

Williams
Iguodala
Young
Thomas
Dalembert

That's a super athletic, young nucleus to grow on.

Craig - I was giving an example, not a play-by-play of what is going to happen. Dala probably would not call him, but I guarantee you that (1) Ed would talk to his agent off the record and (2) Ed would make sure that any players on the Sixers that had the same agent as Brand knew that the Sixers had a major $$ interest in Brand.

Those are facts as to what will happen. Whether Brand will come here or not is another story. And, with regard to the recourse issue, players forgo guaranteed $$ all the time in hopes of a bigger, longer deal. Christ, just look at this year's off-season. Gordon, Deng, Iggy, and Josh Smith all turned down $50M + deals. What's the recourse there Craig? None.

Traceman:

So the Hawks can't keep both, and Childress is the more economical option. Sounds to me like Smith very well might be available.
/Morty

Dean, last comment from me on this issue. You seem very confident in the "facts as to what will happen" so I have to assume you have a inside source or something.

One FACT, from what I read, is that Brand's agent, David Faulk, does not represent anyone from the 76ers.

Which one of those players are coming of a major injury and has missed over half the season and counting? Which one of them already has $16m guaranteed for next year?

whats wrong mark ? wheres your customary column follwing a sixers loss that tells us "ignorant" fans who know nothing about the game how hard they are playing and "never quit" well since they seem to quit quite frequently on any offensive 1/2 court set..they have no interest at all in playing any game not run at a break neck pace in witch they have to play almost no defense...well that works with amare,marion,nash,barbosa not so much with miller,evans,sammy,kevin ollie and id comment on how they quit on defense but you'd have to play defense atleast once to quit playing it...so i guess your right there that the sixers never quit on D..because they never even start playing it to quit....teams that are "worth watching" after the phillies get to clearwater dont blow 20 point leads to sub .500 teams ..as always your a moron but i guess if the point to this article was that josh smith would be a much better PF then reggie evans or thad then id give you the 2008 no shit award and thank you for exuding you genius on all of us poor suffering know nothing sixers fans

Craig - the whole caveat on this issue, which I've stated from day 1, depends on whether he's healthy. We'll be able to see over the last month of the season if he's healthy or not. He also has to be cleared by team doctors. The Sixers will take the route that I described above ASSUMING THAT THEY WANT TO PURSUE ELTON BRAND. I have no idea if Ed will pursue that angle or not. If he's interested though, what I described above will take place without question.

My whole point here (for the last month) is that if Elton Brand is healthy, why would you not want him here? He's a perennial 20 and 10 guy and is only 28 or 29 years old. We don't have a sniff of that on this team. If you're Elton Brand, why would you not consider a $75M guaranteed deal when you have only $15M on the table right now?

I like Josh Smith so far, but you have to be wary of a guy who's work ethic is questioned. Just our luck, the Sixers will sign him to a max deal and he'll turn into Shawn Kemp and spend the rest of his 20's eating.

Lots of interesting stuff. Everybody loves Smith but lets not get carried away. He definitely shows potential but is he worth a max contract? I'm not so sure and I'm betting Atlanta has some doubts as well. Trackboy1 brings interesting insight into the situation and I agree with him that Smith isn't untouchable. Sure he is a solid player but lets not forget he has not been good enough to lift Atlanta to contender status. Close might not be good enough when signing him could decide the fate of this franchise for years to come.

Food for thought for all the fans who want Smith in Philly. I don't see him as taking Philly to contender status.

Atlanta will do what they think is best and that includes moving Smith if it makes sense. While Traceman seems to be deluding himself with wishful thinking that Smith will not be traded for Miller, I'm not so sure. There is a glaring void at the point in Atlanta and Miller would go a long way towards filling it. The downside is his defense (and age) but this may not be a show stopper if the powers that be think Law is the point of the future. Having a solid offensive point like Miller around might be the best thing to happen to Law.

Not surprisingly Traceman and Tracboy1 as Hawks fans, do not see the same things. I'm betting there is a little truth in what both write. All in all the Sixers need to move Miller while he still has some value left.

While I still can't get over the huge mistake Ed made by trading Korver, lets hope he can do better in his next move. However seeing how well Korver is doing in Utah Playing for Sloan, Ed's priorities might be better served deciding on who will coach rather than worrying about players. If its Cheeks that would be the final straw in my mind that Ed is no better than Billy and might be a whole lot worse. With the season already in lottery territory why not let Bibby (or whoever) run the team to see if someone can show he might be able to turn this thing around.

"Jameer Nelson is glued to the bench behind Carlos Arroyo and Keyon Dooling, and Stan Van Gundy doesn't seem thrilled with any of his point guards, saying Hedo Turkoglu is the only guy who creates shots for other players."

Do you think Stefanski is listening? Orlando is one of the few teams who could reasonably match Miller's salary in expiring contracts. Do you think Miller would be an upgrade in terms of creating shots for other players?

"Jameer Nelson is glued to the bench behind Carlos Arroyo and Keyon Dooling, and Stan Van Gundy doesn't seem thrilled with any of his point guards, saying Hedo Turkoglu is the only guy who creates shots for other players."
-Henry Abbot from ESPN's TrueHoop blog

Do you think Stefanski is aware? Orlando is one of the few teams who could reasonably match Miller's salary in expiring contracts. Do you think Miller would be sufficient in terms of creating shots for other players in Orlando?

Morty, if they played the same position you MIGHT have a point but Smith is a PF who can also play some SF while Childress is a SF who can also play some SG. We have a 21 year old starting SF with a lot of potential in Marvin Williams and a 26 year old All Star SG in Joe Johnson ahead of Childress in the lineup. If you were the Hawks and you could only resign one, who would YOU resign between Smith and Childress?

Recalale, I'M delusional? Now that is funny. You really think that adding an aging PG who can't play defense to our roster in place of our only real shotblocker is going to make us better? Josh Smith is 22 and Miller is 32. The Hawks would be crazy to trade Josh CHILDRESS to Philly for Miller, let alone Josh Smith.

Tell you what Recalale, we'll send you Shelden Williams and Childress for Iguodala. You guys get a tough, good rebounding PF to go along with
Dalembert up front and a very good SF to replace Iguodala. You don't have to worry about resigning Iggy next year. Now if that sounds delusional to you, imagine how delusional you sound when you suggest that the Hawks would accept a 32 year old PG who can't play D for a 22 soon to be all star PF. Besides, Miller will make $10M next year. Take that $10M and either the $3.2M expiring contract of Lorenzen Wright or the $3.5M expiring contract of T Lue and we could use that $13M+ to pay Smoove next year. We also have the $2.8M expiring contract of Anthony Johnson coming off the books. You think the Hawks would rather have Josh Smith or Andre Miller and Lorenzen Wright? Give me a break!

Bottom line is that Smith is just as likely to be a Hawk next year as Iggy is to be a Sixer. Both guys could get big offers and both teams will likely match those offers whether they want to or not.

I hope ATL resigns Josh Smith so we can worry about someone who can play in the paint.

We aren't Phoenix, we're Philly.

Traceman:

For the Hawks it's not nnecessarily about the player as it is about the dollars.

Miller is an expiring contract, meaning they would save, what, 60-70 mil over the next 5-6 years? For an ownership group in disarray, they may not want a big time financial commitment to a player who may or may not be the real thing.

From what I understand Childress is a good solider, and cheaper, while Smith and Woodson don't see eye to eye.

Not saying it plays out like that, just saying is is well within the realm of possibility.
/Morty

Morty - You keep going back to this "saving $$ over a multiple year period." The NBA doesn't work like that. The goal of every franchise (with the exception of Memphis right now) is to max out cap $$ without going into luxury tax territory. Why? Because a large chunk of an NBA team's revenue stream is based on the amount of their team's content aired on the national cable networks and the internet. For example, every time Kobe is on ESPN, ESPN.com, etc., the Lakers get paid. No other team in the league - just the Lakers. Sure there's a small portion of league-wide revenue that's distributed evenly, but the bulk of the content $$ are based on how much air-time your team gets. That's one of the reasons that some of the teams (e.g., Dallas and the Knicks) don't care about going over the cap. They're making twice as much (if not more) in content revenue as they're paying out in luxury tax $$.

Therefore, NO TEAM WANTS TO BE UNDER THE CAP FOR A SIGNIFICANT PERIOD OF TIME. Why do you think Comcast owns the Sixers? One reason - CONTENT. In order for Comcast to sell the team, they need to show content-driven $$. That's why Iverson was here for so long, and when his act wore thin nationally, he was immediately traded. The only reason the organization put up with his sh*t for so long was because of the cash that he brought in.

Atlanta is going to have to spend that money somewhere. Whether it's Josh Smith or a combination of Marvin Williams / Josh Childress, it's going to get spent.

Yes, but how they spend it matters. Perhaps they don't like the idea of tying up 15 mil in one player. Remember the lawsuit one owner brought against the others over the Joe Johnson deal?

Financial flexibility is worth something. That is why expiring contracts are such a valuable trade pieces.

The Hawks have a lot of young players, don't forget, many of whom will also need extensions in the next year or two.

Again, not saying this is how it will play out, and get your Smith Sixers jerseys now. Just saying it is certainly feasible, and worth discussing.
/Morty
Morty and Moishe Recommend...

Give up on Josh Smith! Why does everyone think he is the savior? Do you think this guy can come in and turn this sad sorry franchise around? He is Iguodala but can block shots. Look what big bad DRE did as a #1 this season…nothing. Mr. inconsistent!! He doesn't deserve the money he turned down and will never be a #1 option, a two at best. The sixers are going nowhere fast because the young players wont turn this team into anything. Listen to the names…Lou Williams (bench player), Carney (bum), Willie Green (are you kidding me), T Young (we can give him a shot) J Smith (maybe a 6th man), Admundson (haha), Shav (haha). This team is really terrible- fire MO, never a good coach. Should have kept OB but poor little Webber didn't like to get yelled at so we had to fire him. Can anyone let me know the last time this franchise made a good decision? There was one…firing the bum Billy King!! The man that ruined everything in the 1st place. I've been a fan for life and it makes me really sick how this team has no clue. Good luck Ed because I'm sure you will screw up as well.
I agree with whoever posts about Shaggy…get a life!

I'd love to see Smith come to Philly. I'm just not sure he would fit next to Dalembert. I could see ATL trading him for Miller and maybe Lou Will plus the Utah #1 pick. Like they said above, the ownership is a mess and they have plenty of PFs. Miller would give them a top PG for this and next year then clear $10 million off their cap and Lou is a good young athletic talent that won't require a max contract. They could have a 4 G rotation of Johnson, Miller, Law, and Lou Will. To go with Horford, Williams, and Childress. Talk about an athletic running team. This would also allow them the flexability of trading some of this years cap space(i.e. L. Wright, A. Johnson) for a player who could help this year and next and then clear off the same as Millers. This would give them plenty of cap room going into the 2009 off season. Isn't that the year players like Lebron and Wade can opt out? Just a thought.

I'd rather see them trade Sammy for say Smith and Zaza. But I don't see that happening.

I love the idea of Calderon coming to Philly. I don't see Toronto just letting him walk though.

I like the Tyrus Thomas idea above if they can't pull off any other trades. He is burried on CHI bench and has some potential. I wouldn't give them Miller for him but maybe a Green or Carney. They have plenty of potential free agents and might want one of those players so they can let a player like Duhon walk so they can sign Deng and Gordon.

Just a couple thoughts. I look forward to seeing what Ed does.

As a Sixers fan who lives in Atlanta, I strongly agree with Traceman. The Hawks aren't going to trade Josh Smith to us or anybody else. He is 22, multi-talented, improving, and as Traceman correctly points out, "brings the wow factor" to a franchise that desperately needs it, just like we do. The only shot the Sixers would have would be to try to offer him some ridiculous huge contract that Hawks couldn't/wouldn't match. I don't see that happening either, but it's the only chance I see.

All of this fun to talk about and imagine, but the Hawks see Josh Smith as a franchise player who, while still maturing and improving, can anchor their defense for the next 10-12 years. They're not gonna trade him to us for Miller or Dalembert.

Sorry folks. As much as I'd love to have J-Smoov in Philly, it's not gonna happen.

i see a lot of people writing about why the 6ers should get josh smith and why he would be so good for this team. he's an undersized 4 with no post game and an inconsistant jump shot(with bad form). meaning that josh smith is going to need a couple of more years and who knows what kind of leader he is. there is not going to be a turnaround this season for the 6ers. after this season if they keep their core, maybe trade a.miller or igoudala for who knows(a much needed on the court team leader) and make a bona fide attempt to sign e.brand they will be a much better team next season.

6ers have a team full of projects they don't need another one.

It is amazing how much time is spent talking about Josh Smith.

Can I change the subject. What can't the sixers run a play at end of game and get the ball inbounds. In last two games, Miller was supposed to throw it in and missed the man who first came open (iggy in first game) and passed to someone else (Sam) who could not do anything with it if he caught it. Its almost looked like Miller did it on purpose? I think this coaching staff leaves a lot to be desired.

"I think this coaching staff leaves a lot to be desired."

Enough, whatever gave you that idea? Would it be the fact that if Korver were still here, he'd be playing PF at the end of the game and Thad would be glued to the bench. Or the fact that Sammy hasn't learned a low post move in six years that he's been in the league?

Mo's time is winding down and thank goodness. Big Ed has his coach in mind as well as the team's next PF. I trust that he will do the right thing.

Well the obvious answere is to trade Cheeks.

"Would it be the fact that if Korver were still here, he'd be playing PF at the end of the game and Thad would be glued to the bench."

Amen to that! Now that's datruth.
/morty

Mo is definitely better suited for an assistant position.

How bout this? I ran it through the Trade Machine, it should work:

HAWKS get:
Mo Cheeks
Rodney Carney's socks

SIXERS get:
Josh Smith

Team needs: 1] physical low post threat 2] outside shooter [#1 scorer] 3] big, above average defensive pointguard; J.Smith attributes [ none of the above ] Lets move on.

Like to see Carney build on this. Confidence is a dangerous thing.

Dag, you guys are harsh. This team makes their #!?&!! freethrows and we have 6 more wins and the conversation about the team is alot different. Oh yes to Thad. Carney needs more time before we give up on him. I liked Lou playing at crunch time tonight. Mo needs to do more of this, especially with the team being 19-30. I'd like to see the 6ers make the playoffs but with the youngins playin'. The sixers trading for anybody that does not have a back to the basket game is bull!@$#!.

Yeah...keep those wins coming so we can again get a lower lottery selection. Keep Andre Miller the whole season so we can finish 35-47 and get the 11th pick in the draft. Genius.

Andre Miller sat out the 4th.

"Because a large chunk of an NBA team's revenue stream is based on the amount of their team's content aired on the national cable networks and the internet. For example, every time Kobe is on ESPN, ESPN.com, etc., the Lakers get paid. No other team in the league - just the Lakers."

Dean, all of that is incorrect. The teams share equally the TV revenue. The Bobcats get the same from the national contracts as the Lakers. Now the local TV contracts go to the team.