Deep Sixer

I agree 100% with your views in the blog entry. They need to start making some outside shots so if they get stuck in a half court game teams don't pack everybody inside like Atlanta. I've noticed on the perimeter, teams will leave Thad open as he normally does all his scoring around the basket (most often off rebounds or Iggy driving the lane and passing him the ball). He used to be a good shooter at Tech (48% overall, 42% for treys). If they give him the open shot he has to take it. Make his defender guard him on the perimeter.

D'Oh. One final thing. Watching this team on the run is a joy. This has got to be one of the most athletic teams in the league. Even the Atlanta announcers were raving about the Sixer's athleticism.

Ed said he liked having the athletic lineup and the fastbreaking style. I hope he means it as when they do it is very entertaining and they certainly have the personnel for it.

We scored 80 of 101 pts in the paint and foul line. That won't happen most nights. Great effort by the young guys. Even Carney played well. He isn't half bad if he just stops shooting any jumpers.

If we do end up moving Miller, we will need a pg who is a great shooter. Calderon is a legit option, but the price might be too high.

Hopefully Young and Iguodala and Smith develop more reliable jumpers over the next few years, because we desperately need better shooting. Even if we landed an impact post scorer (or Young turns into one) we still need to be able to take advantage of the open jumpers that a double team in the post can generate.

Is it just me or did anyone else notice that the Sixers decisive run in the fourth quarter came with a lineup of Iguodala, Williams, Carney, Young, and Smith (also some credit to Reggie Evans as the comeback began with him on the floor but accelerated when Young replaced him). It's not the first time that these 5 guys have done this.

This core group of youngsters is a pair of bigs (an athletic PF like Josh Smith and a big-bodied C like Aaron Gray), a guard who can shoot consistently from the perimeter (like Ben Gordon), and a point guard (a youngster like Jerryd Bayless) away from having a team that can contend in the East.

Personally, I don't see Dalembert and Miller as long term answers to get the Sixers where they want to go. Dalembert is way too inconsistent (torched by Heywood tonight for God's sake!) and Miller is getting a bit long in the tooth to play as aggressively as these youngsters want to play.

I look forward to seeing how Stefanski builds upon this core set in the future.

I still don't know what to make of Rodney Carney, aside from the fact that he, like a zillion other players, is athletic

The 76ers will have few games like this, so sixers fan better enjoy it for what it is worth. In listening to the Wizards announcers (I live in the D.C. area), they gave a lot of statistics on why the 76ers are so bad. They can't shoot from the outside, can't score, are one of the worst free throw shooting teams in the league and one of the worst in the league in guarding the three.

That is too much to overcome for a team with limited talent. I don't buy that this team will fall apart when it trades Andre Miller. A. Miller was on the bench for the whole fourth quarter when it made its run tonight.

The only reason for Stefanski to keep A. Miller beyond this year is that he doesn't get a trade package that he likes or that Miller will be more valuable next year with an expiring $10M contract than he is now. Still, there are some young PFs available like Wilcox, Charlie V., Nick Collison, Drew Gooden that are available and would be an upgrade to what we have now.

Carney probably played his best game this year. He's still just an athlete right now, but I'd still give him another year to see if he can get it. If NBA players don't show something by year 3, especially in a contract year, then it is time to part ways.

Thaddeus is getting better every game. I think his jumper will return before the year is out. That was the strongest part of his game in college and the summer, so I think it is still there, it just needs some work. J. Smith looked like he was still bothered by his ankle sprain, but I do like the fact that he went out there and gutted it out.

Fifteen days to trade deadline. Let's do it, Big Ed.

OK! Now that Gasol is with the Lakers and it looks like Shaq is headed to the Suns, does this make any of the other teams pull the trigger on trades they might not have a week ago? Does Houston or Denver or New Orleans HAVE to make a move, just to have a chance? Does Boston HAVE to go get that PG they need? Toronto wasn't even in the Boston or Detroit class! So what does this mean to them? Do they have to make a move or are they just happy if they make it to the Eastern semi-finals?

The trades of Gasol and Shaq could, and I stress COULD, open things up for Ed Stefanski. A team might now make an offer for Miller that blows Ed away. Or how about Dalembert? It looks like the West is stocking up on bigs. I'm sure some team would want Dalembert. I'm not saying Ed should make a trade like Memphis did! They practically gave Gasol away. But the trades of Gasol and Shaq might force another team to offer a package they wouldn't normally. I would trade both Miller and Dalembert if it meant getting back good young talent, expiring contracts, and/or draft picks. A young PG and PF of the future. Calderon and Josh Smith type players. (I'm not suggesting these two specific players just these type players.)

I'm NOT saying this WILL happen, but it makes you wonder just how desperate some of these other teams might be! And how much Ed can steal from them! Hope you have a good poker face Ed!

Watching last night's game made me think that the top priority is a guard who can shoot the 3...even more so then a post presence.

I'd love to see Thad develop into our "hybrid 4"...a better version than Josh Smith. I understand it is just a coiple of games, but at 19, he shows signs of growing confidence to go with some significant skills. I loved the way he tried to force the action on the defensive end.

It feels to me that Iguodala is best as the 3, and Thad could become the 4. A "Billups-type" guard would be huge on this team!

Marc

love your coverage and the fact that you reply to many of us on the blog. I would love to get Josh Smith for almost everything (including get rid of Iguodala if necessary) but to me it seems unlikely for the reasons that many Atlanta fans/residents explained in the comments to your previous entry (thanks, BTW).

I have a quick question for you, and for anyone who bothers. It's no secret that Sixers will need to address the outside/3 point shooting next summer, with a SG that can hit a jumper on a regular basis...

so instead of thinking about borderline all stars or players that will never come, how about thinking about some REALISTIC options? Players that might be available or that we can obtain through trades? Random names out there:

1) Gerald Green (my fav and perhaps the easiest to get)
2) Bostjan Nachbar (my 2nd fav, FA to be)
3) Carlos Delfino (FA ???)
4) Anthony Parker (probably won't come, but he would be excellent)
5) Raja Bell (see above)
6) JJ Redick (??? for 10-12 minutes per game, maybe)
7) fellow guido Marco Belinelli (unhappy in Golden State, with a log jam at SG)
8) Pat Garrity (mmmh... ok, no, LOL)
9) Ricky Davis is a FA as well but I'd pass, honestly, for reasons that I don't need to explain

You got my point, I am thinking about guys that could even come off the bench (in case Iggy plays SG and Thad is inserted at SF, that to me should be his real position) but that are reliable options to score from the perimeter and be dangerous vs zone defenses that are killing us this year

feel free to add more names to my short list (any college player? I don't follow college hoops) or explain why the abovementioned don't fit/won't come

thanks

Lots of stuff to pull from this game, but this MUST be mentioned – the Wiz lost Caron Butler to an injury in the 3rd quarter, and that helped the Sixers a lot.

Ok, to the notes:

For anyone who was paying attention to that Orlando game, that Carney performance shouldn’t have been a surprise. Carney played really well, really smart against the Magic even though he didn’t put any numbers in the box score. Carney should’ve been player of the game last night – Carney played both great team defense and one-on-one offense, whereas Thad made a lot of rookie mental mistakes out there even though he did a good job on Jamison. There was a reason Washington was able to match the Sixers point for point while Thad was in there, but…

Thad’s offense was spectacular. Wow! Kyle who?

According to the Wages of Wins website, starting a small forward at the PF spot will cost teams wins because your average power forward outrebounds your average small forwards by +4. I’ve checked all the stats, and that doesn’t really apply to Thad – he‘s been getting rebounds. He’s doing a good job at the PF position. Two gripes though – he doesn’t set screens for anyone, and he doesn’t box out. He relies on his athleticism to get rebounds, and he’s hardly ever in a good rebounding position. If he fixes this, then we have our power forward (he’s only played 21 minutes at the SF position this year). Jamison got 8 offensive rebounds on him, and although that hasn’t happened in the other games that he’s started, I could see that becoming a problem in the future. What if this guy is our future PF? He can post you up, shoot the J, take it to the rim, run on the break, rebound, man up on defense… Drooling…

Lou MUST MUST MUST get more ball-handling duties. He has really matured as a basketball player, and he’s at his best when you give him lead ball-handler duties. Better than Iggy. As a matter of fact, notice what happens when Lou’s out there with a lineup that doesn’t include Iggy and Miller, and then one of those guys gets put back in – Iggy or Miller will take over ball-handling duties, and Lou almost becomes a non-factor. From what I’ve seen, we’re a better team when LouWill orchestrates the offense, and I never ever thought I’d be saying that about him.

This will never happen, but we should start Miller as our SG, and let Lou run the offense. Miller’s shown that he’s a pretty creative scorer and he’s only an inch shorter than Willie. He won’t have to worry about those speedy point guards.

I can’t figure out what the hell Jason Smith does to make the Sixers a better team when he’s out there, but he does. Look at the score when he checks in, then check it again when he's subbed out. He’s the anti-Josh Smith in that he likes to leave that box score empty, but the Sixers play really well with him in the lineup. The big runs the Sixers made (2nd and 4th quarters) came after he was put into the game, but he didn’t do anything. Or did he? Can someone explain this to me? How can someone affect the game so much but put up nothing in the box score. That big 4th quarter run came to a halt when he was taken out. I checked every stat and number I could find, and the only thing I found was that the 3 best Sixers lineups have Jason or LouWill or both; but nothing in Jason’s numbers show any kind of efficiency. Does he have some expert command of floor spacing? Is his team defense that good? Is it his passing? Perfect defensive rotations? Anyway, I just hope the Sixers spend some time developing him – he’s a tremendous athlete for a 7-footer and has great basketball instincts. He can be more than just a big body for them, and I’d hate for him to be the same player 3 years from now that he is now.

We missed out on Gasol, how about jumping into the Marion sweepstakes. How about:

Phoenix gets:
Iggy
Miller
Ollie(contract)/Evans(toughness,reb)/Green(please?)

Philly gets:
Marion
Alando Tucker/DJ Strawberry

Or no Marion? Is Iggy basically a younger Marion? There's no room for both Thad AND Marion?

Marion is not that good - he is Carney with a little more rebounding. The fast break is fine but we do not run it very effectively - way too many turnovers and picked off outlet passes - I would like to see this team establish a low post presence - Sammy will never provide that - I hope someone is willing to take him off of our hands at the end of the season - he can be effective on a good team as a backup - he is not good enough to be a starter.

Someone please tell me the last team to win a championship purely on athleticism. Teams win championships with chemistry and few mistakes. Playing smart is what wins. Playing defense is what wins. This team doesn't have a whole lot of basketball IQ and they don't play defense very well. A shot blocker and some veteran leadership along with some outside shooting - this is what the team has to start looking for.

In addition to wanting see Lou run the point exclusively the rest of the year, I'd also like to see Mo call some plays for Thad - post up plays. We all talk about needing a back to the basket player, well Thad sure seems to have those skills. Lets see them tested.
/morty
Morty and Moishe Recommend...

Sixerzguy - this is what I have been saying - Dalembert will fill up a stat sheet with empty stats, but his impact on the game is usually negative - it is the things that he does, which are not measured that hurt the team - for example, fighting his own guy for a rebound and knocking it out of bounds - losing his guy defensively - Taking ill-advised jump-shots (these are measured) - getting lost on screens - goaltending, etc. etc.

Jason Smith plays smart - a-la George Lynch - the 2001 team besides AI did not put up big numbers in any category except for blocks - Mutombo also had some good rebound numbers - but it was the defense of Lynch, McKie, Snow and Hill that lead to our playoff run - the shot blocking of Ratliff was also key - the boxing out and the closing off of the weakside player - there was a very high basketball IQ on that team - good coaching - this is what wins

Dalembert's contract made him virtually untradeable the last few years, but I'm hoping that's changed now that he's widely perceived as one of the better Centers in the East. Everyone talks about trading Miller now, while he still has value. I'm on board with that, but this is also a great time to consider trading Dalembert and I hope Ed realizes that. "Hello, Atlanta?... what do you say?"

From our issues on the perimeter offensively & defensively..I like OJ MAYO for this team..He's got good size for the '2' and great size for the point. He's a natural scorer that's always plays intense defense. Equally as important, I think he has the swagger to play in Philly.I would love to see him next to Iggy.

Everyone who thinks Andre Miller had nothing to do with the Sixers win last night...check out the box score.

11 pts, 14 assists, almost all of that in the 1st half.

If he doesn't play the first 3 qtrs, the Sixers are down 20-30 points and that run never happens. Also Morty, you're the one who doesn't want to trade Miller right away, yet you say that you want Lou to run the point "exclusively." What, are you going to let Andre Miller rot on the bench and play him 1/2 the game only? Wow, we'll get some sweet return on him using that strategy.

Someone made a great point above...when did the last team that was a "running" team win an NBA championship. Here's a hint:

Never.

Lakers 1980, 82, 83, 85, 87, 88
Celtics 1981, 84, 86
Sixers 1983
Pistons 1989, 1990
Bulls 1991 - 93, 1996 - 98
Rockets 1994, 95
Spurs 1999, 2003, 2005, 2007
Lakers 2000 - 2002
Pistons 2004
Heat 2006

Does everyone get my point here? Save Jordan (who is the greatest player ever, by far), every one of these teams had a monster low-post presence. We need stability on this team in the post, we need a top-flight shooter, we need a PG that can run the offense and play perimeter D. The "run and gun" style does not work over the long haul.

TRADE ANDRE MILLER, GAIN HUGE CAP SPACE, AND LET THE YOUNG GUYS GAIN EXPERIENCE (AND LOSE). Please don't disappoint us on this Ed, otherwise you're just another Billy King.

A thought on Sammy. I only get to watch about half the games on TV, the other half I stare at a computer screen and watch a series of numbers change for 48 mintues. On the computer, Dalembert dominates. He's blocking shots, making steals, tip in dunks and rebound after rebound. When I watch him in person he seems to loaf, balls take wierd bounces off his hands, he takes really bad shots, and his man scores on uncontested layups.
Sammy seems like a helluva nice guy and I think I root harder for him than any other Sixer, and he seems to be the type of player you hold on to when you get him - a proven defensive anchor. His numbers are good, I say look at some trade options.
Other observations:
Is this team an Antawn Jamison and a decent shooter away from being a good team? I really think Ed is struggling with this. If we sucked a little more I think it would be easy to blow the team up.
A final note, Sixers need to put Sixerzguy on the payroll. The observation about Jason Smith is right on. Good things happen when he's on the floor. Just goes to show knowing how to play the game is just as important as being a world-class athlete. And by the way, he's a pretty good athlete.

I think Thad could become an athletic power foward like Josh Smith. All I think he needs to do is gain a little more weight and improve his post up defense a little bit better. I think he's starting to get control of his handle now and is getting used the faster tempo of the NBA. If he can just improve in those two things I mentioned above, I think he could be our starting power foward next seaon with Iggy at the 3. I agree with the poster above, I think the sixers should draft OJ Mayo, I think he might be the more natural 2 guard they need. With the way the other lottery teams are playing compared(poorly) to how we are playing, I could see us in perfect position in the draft to draft him. He will add more perimeter shooting to our team and also is a great defender. Stefanski should definitely look into trading willie green for more cap space. Green is nothing more than instant offense off the bench and is eating into some of our other young guys minutes.

I think Thad could become an athletic power foward like Josh Smith. All I think he needs to do is gain a little more weight and improve his post up defense a little bit better. I think he's starting to get control of his handle now and is getting used the faster tempo of the NBA. If he can just improve in those two things I mentioned above, I think he could be our starting power foward next seaon with Iggy at the 3. I agree with the poster above, I think the sixers should draft OJ Mayo, I think he might be the more natural 2 guard they need. With the way the other lottery teams are playing compared(poorly) to how we are playing, I could see us in perfect position in the draft to draft him. He will add more perimeter shooting to our team and also is a great defender. Stefanski should definitely look into trading willie green for more cap space. Green is nothing more than instant offense off the bench and is eating into some of our other young guys minutes.

I think Thad could become an athletic power foward like Josh Smith. All I think he needs to do is gain a little more weight and improve his post up defense a little bit better. I think he's starting to get control of his handle now and is getting used the faster tempo of the NBA. If he can just improve in those two things I mentioned above, I think he could be our starting power foward next seaon with Iggy at the 3. I agree with the poster above, I think the sixers should draft OJ Mayo, I think he might be the more natural 2 guard they need. With the way the other lottery teams are playing compared(poorly) to how we are playing, I could see us in perfect position in the draft to draft him. He will add more perimeter shooting to our team and also is a great defender. Stefanski should definitely look into trading willie green for more cap space. Green is nothing more than instant offense off the bench and is eating into some of our other young guys minutes.

This is the definition of John Hollinger's PER (Player Efficiency Rating) from ESPN.com. It's the most accurate measure of a player's productivity on the floor.

"The Player Efficiency Rating (PER) is a rating of a player's per-minute productivity.

To generate it, I created formulas that return a value for each of a player's accomplishments. That includes positive accomplishments, such as field goals, free throws, 3-pointers, assists, rebounds, blocks and steals, and negative ones, such as missed shots, turnovers and personal fouls.

Two important things to remember about PER is that it's per-minute and pace-adjusted."

There are 55 eligible PFs (must play at least 6.09 mpg to be eligible).

Jason Smith ranks 45 out of a possible 55. The numbers don't lie here. The range of PER's is a low of 6 (Brian Scalabrine) to a high of 26 (Kevin Garnett). The average is a 16, the median is a 15. Jason Smith scores an 11.

Matt:

agreed, the potential certainly seems to be there.

Dean:

I am not against trading Miller "right away," I am against trading Miller for cents on the dollar, he is the best trading chip we have right now. I do suspect that his best value will be as an expiring contract, which leads me to believe that he will go in the summer or during next season. And that he will be traded for players, not similar expiring contracts.

As far as Lou, I do not mean sitting Miller. I simply mean that for the 20-30 minutes he is in the game, have in without Miller, instead of playing him at the 2 as Mo. does. Again, this is not some cure-all, its just that this team is going nowhere at the moment, so why not see what our players can do. What are their capabilities, and what can you count on going forward.

You have already dismissed the future potential of Lou as a point guard based upon what? His first real playing time in the league as a 21 year old? Time which he runs at 2 guard the majority of the time?

Let's see what the kids can do. Call plays for Thad, let Lou run the point. Start Jason Smith. Give Carney 20 minutes every night. What do we have to lose?
/Morty

Dean:

I think sixerzguy was making a point about Jason Smith that was very anti-Hollinger.

Every team needs water carriers to be successful. Guys that set screens, guys that run the plays and maintain proper spacing, guys that rotate and close out properly on defense. These are the things that Hollinger and most of the other stat guys cannot measure with PER or other numbers.

Watch the number of times that veterans like Dalembert or Evans don't set proper screens, dive down to the lane for offensive rebounding position while cluttering the lane, or don't close out properly on shots leaving themselves in better rebounding position but more likely to have the original shot made. They fill the stat sheet better as a result. These are moves that don't help the team but make Hollinger numbers look better.

Good basketball is all about chemistry. The young guys - Iguodala, Young, WIlliams, Carney, and Smith demonstrated that last night.

Steve:

Excellent points. You can't ignore stats, we have to be able to quantify things, but you also can't ignore intangibles.
/Morty

Didn't get a chance to watch the game, but Thad's statline really caught my eye. This guy is 19 years old? Quite impressive! Anyone care to recap how he got most of his buckets? Also, nice to see Carney put together a solid game, I've been pulling for him.

Steve / Morty: Last night was a once out of every 20 game occurrence. How many times do the Sixers get down 10-15 points and lose? 95% of the time. Yes, Rodney Carney played well in the 4th qtr, as did most of the young guys. But that kind of game is going to happen 2 or 3 times a year. You need to use the proven NBA model that has worked for decades. Save Jordan, we need a legitimate #4 low-post threat, a big-time scorer, and a PG that can initiate the offense and play good perimeter D.

Rodney Carney doesn't give you that. Lou Williams is a combo guard that thinks SCORE first. Jason Smith is not a low-post threat. You really want to see this current bunch develop over the next 3 years, only by growing in the draft? I'll tell you how it's going to turn out.

We still won't have a big-time shooter, we still won't have a perimeter defender at the PG slot, and we still won't have a low post threat which will equal year after year of win totals in the high 20s to mid 30s and draft picks from 8-12 in the 1st round.

This is my lst comment on the Sixers. I enjoy watching them when they play well, which is seldom these days. After reading some of the comments, I couldn't agree more with the alleged Wizard announcer's comments re: the Sixer performance this year, i.e., can't make free throws(I don't get this...what is Cheeks doing to address this???), can't shoot from the outside or score consistently (probably need a trade here...too much inconsistency, can't or won't) guard against the 3's (is this another Cheeks problem??). Lastly, here's a couple of my pet peeves...Iggy hot-doggin' it (for whatever reason & on a team that sometimes looks as if it doesn't belong in the pros (again, I can't believe Cheeks ok's this kind of performance); Dalembert...the guy is a picture of inconsistency and frequently, appears as if he doesn't have clue what he's doing out there. This team has shown that it can play defense (when it wants to...that's a big part of the problem); however, the Sixers deperately need consistent scoring from both inside and out and until that happens, I think Sixer fans will have to endure sub-par performance indefinitely. (for what its worth, I sure hope Stefanski has a plan to address this...AND SOON. Even with last night's W over the Wizards, I start most Sixer contests wondering how badly we'll lose.

Hollinger's PER is useless. Hey, I'm a stats geek too, I take stupid little notes and make my own formulas. But there's always major holes. You simply cannot measure intangibles, all the variables and talent. First time I did this I concluded Pete Incaviglia was the best outfielder in Major League Baseball.
After that I learned to keep my lists to myself. They're fun, but not to be shared.
Just look at the PER rankings and do this simple test: Is that guy really better than that guy?

First of all, if carney keeps playing that kind of defense, he needs to play significant minutes every game. He's a natural at that 3/4 trap and it really got into the wiz's heads. Second, thad is a beast on offense. He was one board short of a double-double and three pts and one board short of 20/10 in 33 minutes. He's clearly thriving in the starting role.

And i totally agree that Jsmith effects the game without putting up numbers. He sets a mean pick/screen, and is one of the only ones who does so regularly. It leads to baskets for teamates, even though its not counted as a stat. I need him to take some yoga or ballet or something though, because he does seem a little stiff out there most nights.

And the credit for the win goes the the young guys - they were scoring effiecently BUT LOOSING ANYWAY when miller was out there. Whenever he came out, they made a push. Someone said it seems he holds the young guys back when they want to run, and i think there's something to that. Every game has a different dynamic, but in this particular game he was having more negative impact than positive. And that's why he didnt play the 4th.

As a matter of fact, i think the only way he gets traded before the deadline is if the youngsters keep winning without him. I know certain people want to see lottery balls more than anything else (and i dont think its the worst thing either) but the bottom line is they're trying to win every game. But im still not seeing him going, because as morty says his best value is still as an expiring contract after the season is over. Unless, as always, an offer that cant be refused is made.

Dean:

I agree with you in terms of player needs - a solid PF, a guard who can score from the perimeter, and a PG who can run an offense, make free throws and defend. I also think the Sixers need a big-butted center who can defend the strong low-post guys in the league.

Those are four guys to add to the core of Iguodala, Carney, Williams, Young, and Smith.

And Miller and Dalembert should be used to get there sooner than the draft will allow.

I can't believe that I haven't addressed this before because it drives me nuts every game.

How bad is the Sixers free throw shooting? They shoot 70.6% from the line, while their opponents shoot 77.8%. 70.6% is almost unacceptable at the college level.

Dean:

I'm not talking about three years, stop distorting what I'm saying. I am talking about THIS year. How can we know what we need in the draft and free agency or via trade if we don't know what we already have? Lou is shoot-first because Mo tells him to shoot, and plays him at 2 guard. I'd like to know if he could run the point, lets see him play it extensively the rest of the year so we can know. What is so hard to understand about that?
/Morty

The free throw shooting is atrocious, that i can wholeheartedly agree with.

And morty, even though i still like williams better as a sixth man than a starting pg, i do agree that we need to see more of him at point - just because as a loosing team we have the opportunity to get a look at him without jepordizing anything. Dean, if you think wont cut it and you want to loose, i dont see why you'd have a problem with this...

I remember when Thad was drafted and how ugly the comments about him were. Now you see his potential so give some props to BK instead of just hating on the guy. Nobody is perfect but he did put in place some good players. Now lets see what Stefanski is gonna do with what he got.

The thing about Thad Young is he was the 3rd best high recruit going into college behind Oden and some guy named Durant (he dominated Durant in a couple of the pre college camps). He's young and looks like his potential is going to develop. But is he a power forward? Against Antwan Jamison, yes. Playing against Amare Stoudemire, heck no. I really like him at the 3 spot. And I may be in the minority, but I like Dala starting at the 2 spot and taking minutes through the course of the game at the 3. That being said, it's not like we are only a PF and a Guard away from being contenders in the East.

I've said before I love the idea of getting Rose or Bayless in the draft and running Lou as a combo guard. Especially with an athletic freak like Rose. Would I have a problem with Mayo? No. But he's proven to be much less a distributor than his hype proposed. Can Lou develop into a lead guard? Maybe, but are we all willing to bite the bullet at the 20 minute stretches where he looks awful trying to run a team?

I said it before I'll say it again, we are so young that I want to bring in a young pf to grow here. Three names I'd like to hear in a Miller deal...

Tyrus Thomas
Biedrins
Diaw

Give me any one of the three and lets try to develop them. Cause the more I think about it the one guy whose game would match what we're doing is Jermaine O'neal...and his legs just have too much wear and tear for his age.

KM:

Exactly. If we run Lou extensively at the point and he sucks, then we lose games and get a better pick. And if he turns out to be good at it, we know we shouldn't draft a point guard. It's a win-win.

And the same goes for extensively playing, and running plays for, Carney, Thad and Smith. How else do we know what we have to work with going forward?

That's why Stefanski basically ordered Mo to play the young guys more when he took the job. Now Mo needs to take it to the next level.
/Morty

Theo:

You are not alone at being OK with AI at shooting guard instead of SF.
/Morty

Morty,

I know, but people are trying to force Young into a hybrid pf spot which I'm not crazy about. Just think of

Lou
Dala
Young
Tyrus Thomas
Dalembert

running the floor. That's scary for any opponent. Then we just need to make jump shots and BOOM! title.

Was happy they won last night, was unhappy they lost the night before, because they should have been able to win against Atlanta.

Williams should be the point. It's clear that Miller is too slow to be an adequate defender, Lou has speed to burn.

Thad is a ball player, and appears to be a good one. Good speed, good instincts for moving without the ball, understands how to get open very well for a young player. But he's just too short to be a 4 against most teams. You need a height parity or advantage in the NBA.

This means that Thad is your 3 which makes Iggy your 2 guard.

Dalembert does ok some nights, he is keeping us in games with his rebounding and defense. If we trade him, we need to replace what he gives us.

We are weak at the 4 and 5, and many of them are rookies on the bench that we haven't seen. Where is Shavlik Randolph, Herbert Hill and Amundsen?

Right now, Smith is your 4 and Dalembert is your 5. The problem is the Sixers don't have a backup Center, Evans does a good job as a 6th man.

Carney seems to be improving and is certainly good enough to be a role player as is green. Their youth suggests that you keep them and develop them, unless someone really gives you more for them than you expect.

We have Andre Miller and Gordan Giricek to trade. Maybe Cheeks will figure out that Gordan can shoot well enough to bust a zone.

I think with an upgrade at Center and PF this team becomes a possible contender.

There is still no inside game- our scoring comes off of fast breaks. Sammy isn't a post player, but the Sixers need to have 3-4 plays for him anyway. It seems the Sixers are better when they get Sam involved with some lobs early in the game. It is important to give Sam a chance to get the other teams' stater into foul trouble. To do that, Sam needs the ball in space where he can work.

We still need a better half-court offense- just beating guys off the dribble doesn't work against teams like Detroit. You have to execute and run plays. We only have slashers. At least J. Smith gives us sure hands in the post to pass back out.

Defensively, unless we force turnovers, we can't seem to make teams miss. I don't know what it is about the Sixers, but they seem to turn teams into all-star outside shooters. That's why the young players are better- they force more turnovers with their energy.

I also like Iguodala at 2 and Thad at 3 eventually, and Biedrins is a restricted FA this summer, so we should have the opportunity to make a play for him.

Just to clarify, I proposed those three names for various reasons, not just picking them out of the sky.

Biedrins,a is stated above is restricted. and GS has to sign both Ellis and Davis this summer to significant deals.

Diaw is a player I personally like. He gets a soft label, but who exactly is hard as nails in PHX? He's an excellent passer and is young. He could develop into a very reliable power forward, given the minutes.

Tyrus Thomas is the player I have on my Xmas wishlist. Lord knows what's going on in Chicago. They've been playing well of late and Thomas has been losing minutes to Joe Smith and ET/Noah. They desperately need a point guard. Hinrich showed he can't be that guy for the Olympic team and he's shown it thus far this season. I see no reason a Thomas and Duhon for Miller deal can't be worked. Chicago gets a very good pg if they think they can still make a solid run and cap relief in two years. Which they will certainly need if the McGrady for Gordon rumors are true.

Morty - I hope they run Lou at the PG slot for 48 minutes a game. I was just pointing out your inconsistencies about how you don't want to trade Miller, yet you want Lou to play at the PG slot exclusively. How can that happen if Miller is still here...

What, play Andre 15-20 mpg? Then, his trade value goes down to zero. No, the only way that Lou gets the minutes at PG to see if he can handle the position is if Miller gets dealt NOW.

You can't have it both ways bro.

I have no interest in Biedrins, period. Tyrus Thomas, on the other hand, I agree with you there big time!! He's got some ridiculous upside. The only question is how do we get him from there to here?

I don't think the Bulls want Andre Miller and his salary, as they have two tough decisions to make re: Gordon and Deng in the off-season. Plus, they just inked Hienrich to a 5 yr deal at $11M per. Plus, they still have Ben Wallace on the books.

But I agree that Tyrus Thomas would look SWEET here.

Dean:

Geez, there are 48 minutes in the game. Here is your template: play Miller for 30 and Lou for 18, vary according to how well Lou is doing.

Other teams know who Miller is,he a 10+ year veteran. If he plays 25 minutes one game his stock will not drop accordingly.
/Morty

Biedrins is very athletic and loves to hit the boards. He's someone that could turn into something solid.

Here's why I think the bulls do something. Call it thinking ahead, but because the bulls have those contracts it's a good in between to get a true point guard in Miller and only have his contract for a year. At year's end his contract becomes super trade-bait for them.

They've also missed out now on every major theoretical trade possibility. KG, Gasol, Kobe, Jermaine O'neal...they've all been rumored to be wanted by Chicago in the past. Chicago has instead chosen to stick with their guns and see what happens. What happened was their window seems to be closing when it was only open a crack to begin with. I can easily see Gordon for McGrady coming soon. If that happens they are ready to win now. So why not take a flyer on Miller for two years? It's not that far-fetched.

Marc:

I wonder if you are interested in weighing in on Lou's potential as a point guard if given a long look? What are your thoughts on the matter?
/Morty

I commented on here before about Thad possibly being a future 4. I just want to state that what I meant was if he continues to play well against other power fowards than it's an option, not the solution, but something to consider if he is consistant enough throughout the remainder of the season against other power fowards. I have no problem with Thad playing the 3 and Iggy playing the 2. That was actually the backup plan that I forget to mention in my previous comment. If the sixers were to go with this lineup instead than they would definitely have to go after a free agent power foward like josh smith. If I were Stafanski I would sit on trading miller until the end of the season. We eventually do have to trade him in order to secure additional cap space we could possibly sign a free agent like Smith. If Stafanski were to trade miller before the deadline, they would have to play lou at the point. In my opionion I really think lou is more of a combo guard who could come off the bench for instant offense. The sixers would then have to consider getting a point guard in the draft like bayless, rose, or gordon. Many people don't think we'll have a high enough draft pick to get rose, but if Stafanski does trade a veteran guard like miller, then lou would have to really adjust at being the point guard the rest of the season. Adjusting to this role for him would likely lead to losses which would increase our chances of getting rose.

I commented on here before about Thad possibly being a future 4. I just want to state that what I meant was if he continues to play well against other power fowards than it's an option, not the solution, but something to consider if he is consistant enough throughout the remainder of the season against other power fowards. I have no problem with Thad playing the 3 and Iggy playing the 2. That was actually the backup plan that I forget to mention in my previous comment. If the sixers were to go with this lineup instead than they would definitely have to go after a free agent power foward like josh smith. If I were Stafanski I would sit on trading miller until the end of the season. We eventually do have to trade him in order to secure additional cap space we could possibly sign a free agent like Smith. If Stafanski were to trade miller before the deadline, they would have to play lou at the point. In my opionion I really think lou is more of a combo guard who could come off the bench for instant offense. The sixers would then have to consider getting a point guard in the draft like bayless, rose, or gordon. Many people don't think we'll have a high enough draft pick to get rose, but if Stafanski does trade a veteran guard like miller, then lou would have to really adjust at being the point guard the rest of the season. Adjusting to this role for him would likely lead to losses which would increase our chances of getting rose.

OK. I am lost. A couple of you referenced Dala. Who is that?

Thad and Carney are a couple of decent players who with more playing time and development can be good pieces to a winning team. Thad so far has really showed to be a quick study who’s success I believe is directly related to that and the fact that he plays within the boundaries of his game. He is doing a good job playing to his strengths, hanging around the basket for clean up or dump off passes, taken jump shots only when wide open, rebounding and hustling. Carney, although slowly getting better, does not seem to know what kind of basketball player he needs to be at this level. Everything seems to be 100 miles per hour with him and he just needs to slow down and concentrate on defense. I think that if he does that his offense will come. Play defense (with his athleticism he has the potential to be an awesome defensive player) and get out on the break and run. Resist the temptation of the jump shot at this point.

dwayne, dala=Iguodala

Versatility is a nice thing to have on a team. I see Thad as a 3/4 and Iggy as a 3/2. If we acquire a low post 4 [K.Love,Brand] and a pure 2 [Gordon,Mayo,M.Ellis] than this team will be able to run and play halfcourt [versatility]. I know A.Miller is ripped for his lack of lateral quickness on defense, but instead of looking at what he can!t do, lets look at what he can; good at running halfcourt and fastbreak types of offense, and also good at the end of games taking the last shot.It wouldn!t be the worst thing for him to be part of this teams future. A lot of teams are worse off than us at the 1, itis a tough position to replace. Right now we have 2 major holes, lets fill them through free agency and the draft, and let L.Will. develop and 2 years from now we may have our pointguard.

"I'd like to know if he could run the point, lets see him play it extensively the rest of the year so we can know."

18 minutes / game for 30 games is not extensive and is not a large enough sample of time to see if the guy has the ability to run a team on a full time basis.

If you want to see if he works at the spot or not, he has to be "the guy" for an extended period of time. If they trade Miller and hand the reigns over to Lou for the remainder of the season (35 mpg), that will be a nice sample from which to evaluate. 18 mpg does nothing to see if he's the PG of the future.

L.Will. was a scorer in h. school ,he would be a senior in college this year ? Two years from now he!ll be 23 ? All I!m saying is he is a work in progress. We may not fill all our holes this summer.A 4 and a scorer[ shooter ] should be our first steps.

Dean:

Alright dude. 18 and more minutes running the point for 36% of the season is not enough to know to know whether 21 year old Lou in his first real season is the next Steve Nash. You got me there.

Sorry I suggested exploring our young player's capabilities, return to normal programing.
/Morty

Biedrins can rebound and hustle, but remember for some reason he was adamant he didn't want to be drafted by the 6ers. Wouldn't work out for them if I recall, and not sure why, granted that was three years ago.

Dean, teams share all national TV contract money; they keep their local TV contract money. Not sure about apparell revenue.

Morty, by normal programing i guess you mean discussing elton brand and josh smith? thats the focus of this board, right? :)

KM:

Actually, I meant discussing how to reacquire Steven Hunter - with his I'm-a-7-footer-who-doesn't-rebound, and 3 years with 3.6 mil per on his contract - to be our backup center without having to give up anyone other than Andre Miller.

Do you think we could make that happen?
/morty

BTW, everybody knows about the ESPN trade machine?

I have the perfect 3-team trade! OK! Well maybe not perfect, maybe it's just me and my wishful thinking but hay, what else do us, Sixers fans, have to do?

CHI gets:
Miller (Phi)
Carney
Randolph
Booth
Amundson

TOR gets:
Dalembert (Phi)
Duhon (Chi)
Griffin

PHI gets:
Calderon (Tor)
Dixon
Nesterovic
T. Thomas (Chi)
Khryapa
1st round pick from either or both maybe

Chicago gets their PG, a young athletic player in Carney and 3 expiring contracts. (Yes, Booth has a player option but that just means he'll be the expiring contract in the off season that everybody seems to want) And they don't give up any player that really contributes a lot. Thomas, Khryapa, and Griffin are 3rd stringers most nights. And their pick will be in the 20's if they make the playoffs.

Toronto gets the C they need to play with Bosh. Bargnani isn't that good and needs time to develop. They get a PG in Duhon to back up TJ Ford. (And since they already have over $8 million/yr for next few years commited to Ford, Calderon is expendible for the C they need.) And Duhon has an expiring contract and Griffin expires next year.

Philly gets there PG of the future in Calderon and possibly there PF of the future in Tyrus Thomas. (If he doesn't turn out, then he's only signed through next year) The rest of the contracts are expiring so they have even more cap space in the off season. Yes, Nesterovic has a player option for $8 million next year but that wouldn't really hurt the cap space (same amount owed either Miller or Dalembert) and he would have the expiring contract that seems to be so valueable (i.e.-Gasol for Kwame Brown and his expiring $9 million dollar contract) Not to mention the extra picks if they can get any. This would give them a ton of cap space, multiple 1st round picks, and fewer holes to fill.
PG-Calderon
SG-Iggy
SF-Young
PF-Thomas (if he works out)
C -?
Only the C position would need to be filled. Maybe a 3-pt shooter too. They would still have Lou Will, Green, Evans, and Ja. Smith coming off the bench. Sounds like a solid young team to me!

I think this trade makes sense for all 3 teams, at least in my world! But then again I'm not sure what color the sky is in my world! LOL!

it doesn't matter how many good players you have if you can't effectively run your halfcourt sets.the 6ers coaching needs to be addressed as much as any player movement.

I'm cool with the Sixers not turning the point over to Lou prior to the trade deadline thereby devaluing Andre Miller. I guess I'll buy that.

But AFTER the trade deadline I'm all for giving Lou the opportunity to run the offense for 30+ minutes per game. At that point Andre Miller's real value will be as a salary-cap- reliever, no?

I'd love to see Eddie do a BIG deal with Toronto as I like some of their players.

PS: I don't have a boxscore in front of me but it seemed like last night Iggy caught the free-throw shooting virus that is KILLING the sixers this year. What is the deal?

Dala Dala bill y'all.

the 6ers should go after villanueva now while the price is low.

Iggy can walk, use his money to land Josh Smith draft one of the 2 guards in college mayo/gordon etc etc...,

Play Thad at the 3. We need someone who can shoot the 3 at 2 guard. I don't really think Thad is a 4 at all he is perfect for a 3, and Iggy does not shoot well enough to be a 2 guard in this league. I like him but his skill set makes him a tweener and you can't have 4-5 tweeners on your team it won't work people need defined roles, and expectations.