The Zo Zone

Jenkins? I know they need help in the OF, but is this the guy that is able to do it. I like his power numbers, they will increase at CBP. I am still getting a little impatient, they really need that big starter (1-2 spot). Benson will be help. but not at #1 or #2. I know there is plenty of time before February, but I really hope they see the possibility of beginning a long stretch of NL East, NLCS, and WS games with the addition of that #1-2 starter. I am not saying they need to spend a ton of money, paying for Silva or Lohse is not going to get you there, but a smart trade will! There are guys I am willing to part with to gain that #1-2. Victorino, Kendrick, Carasco, Ruiz, 2 other prospects. It seems as if the trades to get that #1-2, take 5-6 guys.

What are the phillies really doing? Jim Edmonds was got traded to SD for prospects? did they even try to get him?Rowand gone? he could have been signed in a 4 yr deal! the best players in the free agent market are gone; and there have been trades for 3rd baseman, OF, middle relief all over the map.. why are the phillies sitting on their hands???

I'd like getting Jenkins. There's news this morning that the Padres traded with the Cards for Edmonds. I wonder if that signals them being out of the Jenkins race.

Wade just Valverde - the league leader in saves from arizona... so getting rid of lidge - he was dumb like a fox

Come on people. Quit complaining about not paying millions for guys you won't want by the end of the next season. Edmonds was good in his day, but his day was "yesterday." Loshe is not worth what he's asking for, but someone will pay it. Eaton was a mistake the day it happened. Do you want the Phils paying for another mistake? Making a deal for the sake of making a deal makes no sense. The hope is in the Farm system. It has to be improved.

THERE'S ALWAYS AN EXCUSE FOR NOT PULLING THE TRIGGER ON SIGN A PLAYER- THE HOLES AT 3RD-OF- AND RELIEF PITCHING ARE STILL THERE... SO WHY DID SOME THE BEST FREE AGENTS/TRADES GO ON - WHILE GILLICK WAS NAPPING?

Just what we don't need, lefthanded bat, that strikes out a lot. I'm gone to let Gillick in on little secret. We don't need any more POWER HITTERS. We have a ballpark, whereas contact hitters can hit HR's. What happens when the opposing team goes to the bullpen ? How many right handed pinch hitter do we have ? I'm guessing he wont make us stronger on defense. December, and I'm already scratching my head.

Just adding this to the OF rumor discussions:

Add the Phillies to the list of teams interested in Mike Cameron, reports ESPN.com's Jayson Stark.

Earlier in the offseason, the Phillies had indicated Cameron wasn't on their shopping list. But now, in the wake of Aaron Rowand's signing with the Giants and the breakdown Friday in Cameron's negotiations to return to San Diego, the Phillies have expressed interest, according to a source with knowledge of the discussions.

Cameron was the center fielder in Seattle when Phillies general manager Pat Gillick was the GM there. And with the loss of Rowand and Michael Bourn (traded to Houston), the Phillies are looking to add either a center fielder or right fielder, with Shane Victorino manning whichever of those two positions they aren't able to fill. The Phillies also continue to speak with the agent for free-agent outfielder Geoff Jenkins.

Other teams believed to have some degree of interest in Cameron include the White Sox and Rangers.

seriously, people. Why is everyone calling for Gillick to make a move just for the sake of making a move? If you'd pay attention to the free agent market, you'd know that it's full of nothing but worthless crap. Why pay a ton of money to a crappy player? Lohse won't help. Silva won't help. Padilla won't help. People the Phils already have in their organization will be better than these guys. Gillick just won't give up his payroll for mediocrity, and I don't blame him. I wanted Rowand back, but in 4 years, he won't be any good, and then we're stuck with him. And the same people who are yelling at Gillick now for NOT signing Rowand will bemoan the stupidity he showed when he signed him for a 5 year deal to begin with.

And don't even suggest he should trade away the farm...an organization that wants to be competitive consistently needs a good farm stocked with prospects, or else when the day that Utley and Howard and JRoll are gone, the Phillies will once again be a talentless laughing stock. Do we want to be like the Marlins are now? I don't think so.

All the back-seat GMs here need to chill. There's a reason why Gillick was the architect of World Series teams, and we're all sitting here in front of a computer working our 9-5 jobs.

I agree philsfan. Also, we're a few months away from spring training. A lot can happen. At a minimum, I expect them to sign a quality outfielder like Jenkins and find a better-than-Eaton starting pitcher. I think we may also see bullpen additions (like Otsuka who they're talking to) and a 3B upgrade. The back end of the bullpen is already stronger on paper. The rotation is harder to predict, but if Kendrick wasn't a fluke and Moyer has anything left, then having Myers back as a starter makes the rotation as least a tiny bit better than 2007. 3B is no worse than it was in 2007. If they trade away their pitching prospects we'll all be complaining about having some washed up no-arm in the lineup a year or two from now. It looks like Carrasco and Outman could be ready in 2009.

And as for a #1 or #2 starter, they aren't out there, espcecially for what the Phils would have to offer in a trade. Not to mention, with Hamels and Myers, are we really in need of a #1 or #2? We need a solid 3, 4, or 5 option. Someone that isn't a waste every fifth day like Eaton. The sky still isn't falling just because some teams are making deals and the Phillies aren't. Get a grip.

Any interest in Prior from the cubs?

An article I read somewhere today said the Phils are not interested in Prior. But we know they often say one thing and do another so nothing's for sure until he signs somewhere.

Does Mathieson factor into the pitching picture at all? He should be back from TJ surgery, right? I'm guessing he's a thought for the pen?

Trading Prospects for a #1 or #2 can be done, Hamels and Meyers are projected to be 1-2, but their health is a question, you can't deny that. They have 6 picks in the 1st 120 in next years draft, they could easily refuel after trading away some current prospects, do not rule it out. If the Phils are looking at Cameron and Jenkins, maybe they have other plans to trade Vic.
Rowand, LET IT GO!
I do think Gillick will get something done that pushes the team forward. He is extremely more aware of the game than we are,
I work 8 to 4 by the way.
He has made moves to keep the Phils in the hunt since he has been here. Moved Thome, got rid of Abreu, that was not easy, picked up Garcia (Not Gillick's fault he got hurt), grabbed Lohse and Iguchi for cheap, and picked up Romero and Lidge. He knows what he is doing, and will not pay for mediocre help. We have medicocre help: Werth, Ruiz, Coste, Dobbs, Moyer, etc. We also have Great Offense: Rollins, Utley, Howard. and we have the makings of a solid pitching staff, Hamels, Meyers, Kendrick, Lidge, Gordon, Romero, we are going to be okay and Gillick will make the move that pushes us there!

Jenkins will not come here. Gillick cannot pull the trigger on free agents. He is an over-the-hill GM whose knowledge and drive to win are
antiquated. Wait and see, Jenkins to San Diego.

As now I hear that the Phillies are looking at Cameron now which is interesting since he just was mentioned in that Mitchell report. I didn't think the Phillies would look into him after that. Perhaps they are intested in getting both Jenkins(bats left) and Cameron(bats right).

And John Gill, correct me if I'm wrong but Gillick was a quick trigger when he signed free agents Helms, Eaton, and Barajas.

Cameron and Jenkins would leave the door open to trade Vic along with others. I may hav eto disagree about Jenkins to SD becaus of the Edmunds trade, John Gill, your thoughts? Quick trigger on those players also redulted in 3 players that did absolutely nothing last year and are not projected to help this year! Bedard for Vic, Kendrick, Carasco, Cardenas, and ??? Done deal from my standpoint.

Bedard for Vic, Kendrick, Carasco, Cardenas, and ??? Done deal from my standpoint.

That's the dumbest deal I've ever heard. Too much give and not enough take.

Hey AnonymAss! Have you been paying attention to any of the Major League Baseball Deals that have been going on??? Everyone has either been overpaying or over trading for Big names. Look at Heran, Cabrera-Willis, Rowand for 5yr-$60 mil, Hunter 5yr-$90mil. If you want the players you either need to pay for them out of the anonymAss or trade out of the anonymAss! I would trade those players without a second thought. That would give the Phils Bedard locked for 2 years, Hamels for at least 2 until they sign him long term, Meyers for 2-3 years. With 3 string starters they would only need to find a 4-5 that could give good support. You have that in Moyer and you can find a cheap 5-man (Benson, Blackley, Colon, etc). You would be giving up 2 major league level players that are good and young and 3 players that are only prospects, plus you have 6 out of the 1st 120 draft picks for '08 to replenish the Farm. You have got to give to get. If you have 3 solid starters for 3+ years that gives you time to develop younger players. Strong 3 have been wining WS forever, Braves, White-Sox, Marlins, BoSox, etc.

big mistake trading bourne! michael,jimmy,chase 1,2,3, great D up the middle with speed. shane in right. what are they thinking.

I did like Bourn a lot as well, but there was no telling if he was going to be a lifetime .250 high strike out guy at the top of the line-up or .300 who caused havoc for other teams, he did not play enough to be kept as the future. Rollins is the lead off man, he will not be moved from that spot. He has sick numbers in that spot. Bourn landed the Phil's a proven top notch closer (Lidge) that needed a change of address. Great move, you cannot give up nothing and get something in return. It is still about pitching! Burrell, Bourn, Werth, Ruiz, Helms, Dobbs, Rowand, Vic were and are all support players for Rollins, Howard and Utley. They still need the big pitcher for the top 3 of the rotation.

Seems like Jenkins is a good fit, especially if we can still land a decent starter.

I predict you naysayers are wrong: He's ours. Who wouldn't like hitting here? Who wouldn't like hitting behind Rollins-Victorino-Utley-Howard? "Want some fastballs, Geoff? Here you go..."

Bourne was a nice player who replicated what Victorino offers. Trading him meant landing a closer, which meant landing a starter -- Myers. Had to do it.

I liked Bourn but we kept our two better speed guys: Rollins and Vic. Vic's numbers are higher all around than Bourn. Bourn struggled early in the year so it may just be a matter of him adjusting to the majors and he may set the world on fire in Houston. Either way, he was a good one to trade. You had to give up something for a closer. If Lidge pans out and Myers pitches like a #2, no one will be looking back.

kfil, I only mentioned those players to comment on gill's post about Gillick not pulling the trigger on players. We all know they didn't contribute anything this year. I think this year he's going a little more cautious this year and rightfully so. At least the Phillies were able to clean up most of their mistakes from last season so far - Barajas and Garcia. Helms surprisingly has some interest so hopefully he's gone which leaves Eaton.

I hope they can sign Otsuka to a 1-2 year deal and hopefully get this Jenkins deal done. And hopefully they'll decide on another starting pitcher after they check out Benson. Then get a 3B and talk the marlins into giving up one of their better pitchers for Helms.

The Phils are as close to signing Jenkins as will allow the 1 year $440,000 offer from THE TEAM THAT HAS NO MONEY. As soon as you hear that two teams are vying for the same player, count the Phils out, they're just being played to up the ante for the other team. "Compete" and "Phils" are not two words that go together in the financial arena. Ruben "Little Ed" Amaro, Jr. will sweep out the corners and find some guy whose been on the disabled list for the past couple of years and get him for nothing. Right now "Little Ed" is busy. Dave Montgomery has him going through Citizen's Bank Ballpark with a metal detector to see if he can find some loose change to help them sign a bottom feeder. Sorry folks, "Cheap" is the word to describe the Phils.

d, I understood, which was supporting the idea of slowind down and making better decisions. 3B is the last priority! If they get another reliever and Benson, they look good, but still will need the last piece (Starter) to push them over the top. They have 3 guys who can play 3B right now and be active bench players that is a good thing, it keeps players sharp and ready. Sharp and ready when talking about Helms and Dobbs, sorry!

Let's not overestimate what Kendrick would bring in return. He came up huge last season, but he's going to have to do it for another year (or two) to prove it wasn't a fluke. The scouts have never been high on his stuff, and his numbers last year suggest his success will be hard to duplicate (way too many baserunners, way too few strikeouts). He was gutsy and poised from the time he was called up, and he was clutch during a pennant race. I would love to think he'll have a long, productive major league career. But his upside is as a 4 or 5 starter. He's not the kind of player Baltimore is going to be looking for in a Bedard deal.

Why are strikeouts overrated? Must have missed this point. On a team that has the strikeout king (Howard) and other guys who strike out constantly (Utley and Burrell) I would think that avoiding another strikeout guy would be preferable....what does Moneyball say about strikeouts being overrated? If you're striking out as much as the phils you're leaving a ton of people on base....

WE ON'T NEED ANOTHER LEFTY!!! it would be a mistake to put another lefty in that lineup. we have to break up utley and howard and sometimes we cant rely on burrell to do that. antoher lefty means billy wagner comes in the 8th inning and pitches 2 innings to a line-up of lefties. as for 3rd base, yes we have 3 of em but are any a relieable back-up to chase utley or j-roll. that's where we miss nunez the most. if we are gonna keep the platoon at third base then, we should have kept it the way it was. helmscan back up howard at 1st but, who backs up 2nd and short.dobbs can even play first too.we need to bring back nunez more than people realize! and NO we do not need a number 1 or 2 pitcher...hamels and myers will do just find and i even believe in kendrick at the 3rd spot. 4th and 5th spots we do need a starter or 2. make eaton and moyer earn their spots in the rotation. moyer may even be to that point in his career where he just need to become the experienced lefty out of the bullpen dan plesac was for us. moyer pitches to location, not power and sometimes that can be good to mess with a batters mind late in the game. I did like loshe but no he's not worth adam eaton money. benson would be fine. and i think worth can be an everyday starter. like someone said earlier, we don't need anymore power hitters, we need someone to get on base too. contact hitters do just fine at CBP.