The Zo Zone

They should just keep Helms on the roster and have one less pitcher in the bullpen. Having to switch Burrell out of the lineup in the later innings already takes one position player out of play. They ran out of bench players several times last season. We don't need someone like Kane Davis taking up room in the bullpen.

No we can't get rid of Wes Helms. ;-)

I couldn't even type that line without laughing. I'm just happy that the Phillies are exploring any upgrade at 3rd.

Wes Helms will now be traded for the first team to offer anything for him. We'll only get a minor league nobody-never-will-be and have to eat the majority of Helms contract, but hey, at least we have Pedro Feliz to make outs offensively and defensively. Seriously, Feliz is nothing more than a No-Hit Nunez with some pop. I don't like this signing, especially for 2 friggin' years...why 2?!?!?!?!

Feliz will be the next Helms where everyone asks "when is his contract up?"...but at least he can play defense. Helms should stick to first base and never be allowed to play third again. I could see Feliz hitting 30 HRs in this lineup and ballpark however. With the addition of Jenkins and Feliz I think the Phils could set a record for team strikeouts in a season this year.

The Bill James crowd hates Feliz because his OPS or MIA or DOA or whatever you call it was just .290 last year. Who cares? The guy can put up Aaron Rowand numbers and play a decent third base. This is a good signing. See ya, Wes.

I like the signing, I mean at least they are trying to upgrade. At this point I think you need defense the most and now the Phillies have three potential gold glovers in their infield. Sure he'll make a lot of outs, but he'll hit some homers. It also strengthens the team in that now Helms will be gone, Dobbs moves to the left PH role he belongs in and we won't have to use 3 players at 3B every game. The Phillies have enough offense, they can afford to give up some for defense especially when they get a little added pop to the lineup too.

My bad. His OBP was .290, his OPS .708.

So which position player was the biggest waste of money since 2000--Helms? David Bell? Pat Burrrell? Barrajas?

What a collection of dead wood!

Personally, I think Dobbs and Nunez works better. Especially, when you have groundball pitchers like Moyer and Kendrick on your staff.
It's a lack of foresight and a move for a move's sake.
It's a cheap solution to a percieved problem that amounts to a leteral move.

Well I'm with Truth on this one. I don't really like this move. Its a nothing move, and I hope it doesn't cut too much into Dobbs' playing time, because I think they need to find a way to keep his bat in the lineup more often than not, and definitely more than just on a pinch hit basis. As GM-Carson said, its Nunez with some pop.

nunez is on the brewers, truth

Why is Nunez with some pop not considered a pretty significant upgrade over Helobbs?

why do people have a problem with the signing? the Phillies smartly waited until Feliz flinched and signed a below market contract. 2 years at 4.25 mil for the BEST defensive 3B in baseball who will also hit 25 HRs? Feliz will hit 25 more homers than Nunez and is better defensively. good signing.

Really nameless, thats news. Excuse my tense grammatical genius. In hindsight I should have said Nunez Dobbs would have worked better.
I thought maybe the phrase lack of foresight may have gotten me a pass-lol

Tough board.

Feliz strikes out a ton, but he does have power. He is an excellent fielder, though. The Giants didn't resign him because he wanted a multi-year contract and they got tired of waiting for his potential. I'm not sure why the Phils gave him a 2 year deal when no one else would. Still an upgrade over Helms/Dobbs/Nunez...

I am a SF Giants fan and watched this guy daily for last few years and just wanted to tell you guys that you'll be thrilled with Feliz. AT&T is hard park to hit home runs in and he'll add at least 10 per year by being in Philly. Also, he's flawless defensively, albiet a little streaky as a hitter but for most part you got a great deal on a very solid everyday third baseman, who might actually have huge #'s surrounded by your lineup...

I like it, just to get out of yet another platoon situation. There were too many wasted position players when there was a need for a pinch hitter/defensive substitution at third and also doing it for Burrell. It just seemed we were out of bats at the end of a lot of games. However, part of me would have liked to see Dobbs get the chance at the full-time gig. The Phillies have got to hit on one of these third baseman free agents at some point, don't they? After Bell and Helms, it couldn't happen again, could it?

I'm on the fence on with this deal. On one hand the Phils are getting a defenseive upgrade at third base, has slightly more pop is his bat than Helms, and doesn't strike out too much. On the other hand they are getting a player with a low on base percentage. COnsidering what out there in free agency at third base and considering what we have at third base it is a slight upgrade.

This is a great move for the phils. Found this blog post about the offensive and defensive impact of the move.

http://reclinergm.wordpress.com/2008/01/28/welcome-pedro-feliz-respectable-third-baseman/

I'm happy! I've been lobbying for a new third baseman since last year. Glad the Phils finally heard me. LOL!

The Phillies site finally put something up.......

http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080128&content_id=2358074&vkey=news_phi&fext=.jsp&c_id=phi

Anything better than watching Helms swing like his bat weighs 40 lbs. I think Feliz is an upgrade over both the platoon and anything we have had since the brat was shipped out of here for not wanting $140M. Everybody has forgotten that having a right handed power bat to break up the lefties is as big a deal as the stellar defense he will provide. Good signing, esp since he was looking for over $20M at the start of free agency.

Feliz is a definite upgrade over Helms, offensively and defensively. According to Zo, the Phillies inked Feliz to a 2 year deal for $8.5 million and an option for a third, pending a physical. That's less than David Bell was making 4 years ago, so no one can grind about the salary.

Helms was a liability on the field, at the bat and off the bench last year. He could not field his position and was 4-32 as a pinch hitter. There's no reason to keep him around.

Maybe the next move is Lohse, perhaps before the Mets can land Santana. We still might be chasing the Mets if they have a starting rotation of Santana, Martinez, Maine, and El Duque.

This is a step in the right direction.

Surprised no one has pointed out the career .288 on-base percentage... The man simply refuses bases-on-balls. But he should hit for power at CBP.

Given what was available, I like the move. The best deal would have been to see if we could have gotten Joe Crede from the Whitesox, but we had nothing to trade with them. I think he will hit 20 plus homers but he like all of the other Phils strikes out a lot.

Given what was available, I like the move. The best deal would have been to see if we could have gotten Joe Crede from the Whitesox, but we had nothing to trade with them. I think he will hit 20 plus homers but he like all of the other Phils strikes out a lot.

I like this signing. I see some folks mentioning that Feliz doesn't get walks - but neither does Rowand. Feliz's career numbers aren't actually real far behind Rowand's (he knocked in 92 runs in 2006). And doesn't San Fran have a tougher park to hit in? It's a definite upgrade defensively and you have to consider that you now have Dobbs' dangerous bat available for pinch-hitting (altho it's a shame he doesn't get a chance to start). So the bench is strong. All-around it's a good move. Now dump Helms.

If I had my choice of any 3rd baseman it wouldn't be Feliz, but given what is out there FA-wise and the reality of not being able to make a big trade, the Phils did well to get him. Look, most of us have griped about the lack of offense from 3rd base, so if we can get an offensive and defensive upgrade (for all nine innings....Nunez was great defensively, but he played an inning or two a night...Helms was awful and Dobbs serviceable) what's wrong with that? Yes, I hate all of the K's this offense put up last year and this season won't be much better, but HR's and RBI's will be vastly improved at 3rd. Plus, Dobbs can still get 30+ starts there as well as some time in outfield, and added to his pinch hitting most every other game, he'll still get 300 AB,s. In the end, this move is an improvement. Philadelphia's history of 3rd basemen sice Schmidt is pretty sad, so maybe Pedro Feliz isn't so bad afterall.

Anyone who thinks this is a bad signing didn't watch too many games last year. Do you remember cringing every time you saw Helms' name in the starting lineup? I do. Wes should have changed his name to "Automatic Out". Do you remember holding your breath every time Helms or Dobbs threw the ball to first base? I sure do. We got Pedro for cheap, and he's a solid glove at third. Unlike the anemic Giants' lineup, Pedro will get good pitches to hit with plenty of guys on base in front of him. And what's all this talk about Pedro striking out all the time? He had over 550 ABs, and only struck out 70 times. I'll take that over Nunez, Dobbs, and Huckleberry Helms any day. Go out and sign Kyle Loshe and I think we take the division, even if the Mutts sign Santana. Word.

The Phillie's pitchers especially Jamie Moyer and Kyle Kendrick will sleep well tonight. This was a very nice move.

This signing is the best thing the Phils could do. Adrian Beltre in Seattle wasn't ever an option and he's a huge cost anyway. Feliz will be a dangerous hitter at the bottom of this lineup and don't underestimate Cholly teaching him to be a more selective and dangerous hitter. Nothing but upside compared to Nunez who couldn't sac bunt as well as my son. Defensively he will make people forget about our headaches there the past few years. Cholly will have a stronger bench at the end of the game and in extra innings and make more games winnable. Dobbs will get plenty of starts at 3rd when our fly ball pitcher Eaton goes out there and every once in a while to spell Burrell in left against tough righties. This is a huge addition to this team. This is gonna be one helluva team this year. Enjoy them.

Not the quality of his infield mates, but who would have been? Very solid move for the Phillies.

This was a solid move-Feliz is a good glove and a decent bat. Third base was a defensive disaster last year; problem solved. The guy isn't a great hitter but he'll do fine in the #7 hole.

Helms? I'd take Don Carman for him straight up. Maybe the Camden Riversharks are looking for infield help.

I think this puts Dobbs in the role he's best suited for- 20-25 starts at 3B, 15-20 in the OF and 5 or so at 1st and 2nd base, to give Utley and Howard an occasional rest. He'll get 300 or so AB's and I think he'll flourish in that role.

How about this bench- Dobbs, Coste, Bruntlett, Taguchi and Jenkins/Werth? Very solid.

I agree with Tuck, Feliz doesnt have a bad history of striking out alot, just about the same as Rowand, maybe a little less. This is a good signing, and only HELPS THE TEAM!!

This is a great signing. Seventh place hitter will hit .265, 25 HRs, 75 RBIs. And very solid defense.

His defense makes our 6 inning pitchers now 7 inning pitchers, lessening the load on the pen everyday so they're fresher at season's end. His .252 BA will jump to .292 at the bank as his lazy fly balls fall into the flowers.H e alone makes up for the loss of Rowand. Jenkins is added gravy. Our pitching staff is probably on a charter to Clearwater right now, anxious to get a head start on the season. Kyle Lohse is telling his agent to take a hike and he's probably begging to be re signed at whatever the Phils want to offer. Cholly won't have his ulcer churning by the second week of the season. All is well. Watch them run away with the NL East by 20 games this year.

PS- no I'm not smoking anything.

Not a great signing but a good one. It improves the Phills in 2 spots 3B and a good lefthanded hitter off the bench (Dobbs). I did not realize that Feliz was that good a fielder. In a poll in baseball america he did not finish in the top three (Rolen, Zimmerman and Wright were the chices of the players and managers. The Obp is disturbing but maybe he can improve that. The Marlins was interested in Helms before I wish we could get Lindsrom fo him, probably not.

This was a pretty good signing. Feliz played on a pretty miserable offensive team, the Giants. He could pick up more RBI's with the Phillies offense. Will he platoon with Dobbs? I can't see signing him for 2 years and having him only start against lefties and come off the bench to pinch hit. He's probably gonna be your everyday 3rd baseman. Dobbs is versatile and may play some left field and 3rd and spell Howard on occasion. I don't know if you could get more then a box a balls for Helms right now. Whatever they do, this deal makes the Phillies even stronger if for no other reason than Feliz is a better defensive 3rd baseman than both Helms and Dobbs.

i am so very sad to say that I agree with truth on this one. The phillies have the best offense in the NL why spend money on a guy who is at best a marginal upgrade over what we have. I predict a helms trade back to florida and at this time next year, this board being littered with why did we give helms up for nothing and pay his salary only to see feliz produce the same.

by the way I only read like 5 entries, but I am suprised to see a negative opinion on this signing.

Feliz is a huge upgrade defensively over Helms and Dobbs and a huge upgrade offensively over Nunez. I'm sure you remember how much of a pain in the ass it was to watch Nunez come in in the 7th inning knowing you were gonna get no more production from the 3rd base spot the rest of the game or leaving Helms/Dobbs in and watching them get eaten up by a hard-hit ground ball.

There is no blockbuster signing left to take place for us that we need to save up for, I'm glad we spent a little bit of money to get competent offense/defense out of 3rd which will give a whole lot of flexibility to Charlie in the later innings.

I'm a die-hard Giants' fan living in San Francisco... I've watched Pedro (Pete Happy) Feliz since he came up... a realistic evaluation: He's an excellent defensive third baseman... He'll probably give you 25-30 homers and around 90-100 rbi...

...he'll also drive you nuts with completely wasted at-bats... Be prepared to watch this scenario many times over: Runners on first and third... 1 out... Pedro strikes out on a breaking pitch in the dirt... Giants' fans have watched it for years...

He's a good pickup... and since Philly fans are known for their patience (ha...), he should be fine...

...he's solid, but be prepared for the roller coaster of emotions... streaky hitter personified.

I like the move. Feliz is a much better "band-aid" on the gaping wound that was 3rd base last year.

I like this move. We get Nunez type defense with some bat behind it. Feliz has been hitting around 20 HRs at AT&T. That should go up at CBP. As Jared notes, this move helps ground ball pitchers like Moyer and Kendrick. I was a bit worried about the effect of losing Nunez when those guys were on the mound. Feliz is as good or better and he can hit.

I love his defense, but hate the fact that he's grounded into 71 doubles plays over the past 4 seasons and has a lifetime on base % of .288...good hitters have higher averages than that for crying out loud!

Feliz really doesn't really strike out a lot. He whiffed much less often than Aaron Rowand last year _ 116 to 70. His problem is he doesn't hit for a high average and never walks. He's not a great offensive player, but it's not as if the Phils are adding another 150 Ks to their lineup.

And Feliz is not Abraham Nunez with some pop. He's a significant defensive upgrade over Nunez. Nunez was solid defensively. Feliz is exceptional. Feliz had a much better year defenisvely last year than Gold Glove winner David Wright. If you thought Nunez was slick, wait til you see this guy.

This is not the kind of signing the WIP callers like, but it's the kind that wins games.

Feliz should flourish in Philly. He is a definite upgrade defensively and will hit near 30 home runs here as opposed to San Francisco.
He will probably bat near .265. We will appreciate mostly his defense as it will help our pitchers.

I like this signing. Say he hits .260 with 28 HR's and 90 RBI's in this lineup. He'll hit into 15-20 double plays, whiff 70 times and play great defense. He gives us another RH batter. If that's not a sizable upgrade at that position, what is? Plus it allows Dobbs to split more time with Burrell if he goes dead for a month, like he does on occasion. But I think our non-pitching 13 stack up awfully well against everyone else. Not a bad bench and gives Manual some real options.

That being said, most of us thought that Garcia, Eaton, Barajas and Helms were decent pickups last year at this time. LOL.

Now the pitching....???

To echo jimmymack ... yeah, what about pitching now? They're done at the other positions, so can they land another starter? And is Otsuka still a possibility to add more stability to the back end of the pen? You have to wonder if Lohse will come down in the years he wants. I'd take him back at a 2 year deal, possibly 3.