The Zo Zone

Pat is a DH. Bad feet, can't run, can't play 3rd. Baltimore would be a nice fit in '09. Let's hope Pat lights it up in a walk-year and everyone benefits. Will Mathieson be ready by Opening Day? It would be nice to see a young-hard thrower in the Pen.

Its a nice thought to imagine the Phillies without Burrell. Imagine when Helms and Eaton are gone too?

Imagine if there was no players bitch about?

Guess it will all be directed at Cholly.

ummmmm burrell is better than you think, pitchers know it. i just dont know why you cant. everytime a pitcher pitches around hi, its cause they dont wanna be taken deep. the sooner you recognize burrell as a strong power hitter, the better

Case is right. Burrell can no longer play the outfield in the big leagues. That's why he will be gone. He may make a good DH somewhere but at less than half the money he's making now.

A better question might be, who is going to replace Pat in the outfield? I think Golson is at least two years away and he is not a sure thing.

Please don't tell me T.J. Bohn, Werth, or Snelling. These guys are just roster spots.

Go Phils!

A better question might be, who is going to replace Pat in the outfield? I think Golson is at least two years away and he is not a sure thing.

Please don't tell me T.J. Bohn, Werth, or Snelling. These guys are just roster spots.

That's the rub. For the right price, I would take him back. Show me where you are going to get about 100 RBIs while playing 6 or 7 innings a night?

You might be right Mike, he looked OK the second half of last year but my memory of him will be swinging at those around high pitches and missing. That and around low pitches.

good point Paul, for the right price he might not be so bad. He is good for 100 rbi a year usually. I wonder who will be available next year as a FA to replace him if Snelling doesn't light it up this year.

Beefcake Burrell can still swing the stick (though inconsistently). But he can no longer play the outfield because of the bad wheels. Given that Pat in only 31, the Phils would have already extended his contract if he fit into their plans moving forward.

Pat is not a bad player or a bad dude. However he really does project as a DH. I think this will be Burrell's last year as a Phil though he may have a successful career as a DH in the American League.

Phils could move Jenkins back to LF in '09, his natural OF position. Golson is high on the Phillies charts, he will probably start the season in Reading, the kid can fly!

If Golson has a strong year in Reading, he could be the 4th OF in 2009. As far as F/A possibilities, Jason Michaels might be available after this season. J-Mich (Pat's chauffeur) could platoon in LF with Jenkins in 2009.

We have plenty of time to worry about the 2009 Outfield, we'll talk about that after the parade down Broad Street!

Jenkins could be a possibility... his 162 game average is .277 avg, 28 HRs, 92 RBIs. But it should be noted he has never reached 100 RBIs in his career and he bats lefty, something we already have an abundance of in the lineup.

Personally, I would like to see Pat extended for about 2 years. Unless we can find another Right Handed power bat to replace his presence in the lineup, I think we need to hold on to him. Despite what some of you are saying, Pat actually might have had his best defensive season last year. And like people are saying, its tough to find 30 HRs and 100 RBIs.

If he likes the idea of staying here so much let him take a hometown discount with something like 2 years 15 million.

Burrell might be better off on the West Coast.
Philly likes players that care and show it, thats definately not Pat. His slumps would go over better if he's just smash up something every once in a while in disgust at a strikeout instead of slowly and casually walking back to the dugout. Compare Dykstra and Bowa to Schmidt and Burrell.

I think 8 Mil per year is a fair price for his current skills. I wouldn't consider that a discount. No one is going to give much more unless he lights it up like 2k2.

Todd- that pic of Pat looks a bit gay (not that there's anything wrong w/that)

I really think Burrell has a 2002 type of season/ due to it being his contract year. He is no longer hanging out in the bars and smoking cigs.(I used to see him on a regular basis myself) He had the common sense to show up early for camp.
Believe it or not I really don't see him as a major liability in the outfield on this team. The balls he can't get too Victorino will cover.
I look for big numbers, I think by him redeeming himself last year in the second half took much of the pressure off him. He struck out quite a bit looking in '06 and the pressure became enormous.
I think if YOU the fans lay-off and let him be he will prosper. If YOU the fans get on his back during his first/inevitable slump it could be more of the same from Pat.

I'm no statistician, but this is my impression: He gets very hot for a third or half a season. But the rest of the time, i feel that he is an offensive as well as defensive liability. They may pitch around him, and he may walk a lot, but he seems to take an awfully large percentage of 3rd strikes, looking flummoxed like a deer caught in head lights. especially when a rally is brewing or its a critical spot.

Sam: Flummoxed? Nice!

Truth: You are awesome, man! If the fans "lay-off", Pat will prosper? Should we give Adam Eaton a standing ovation when he takes the mound? If we cheer and applaude, he will out-pitch Johan Santana? If it works, I'm in!

Please. We boo the Babe when he takes the 3rd strike while throwing his ass out of the way, we all know the move.

so we're suppose to hold Gillick's feet to the fire and hold him accountable but lay off Burrell?

If YOU the fans would just protest about Howard being underpaid, if YOU the fans would just not boo Pat, if YOU the fans would just acknowledge the organization is CLASSLESS, if YOU the fans would just not keep missing the point, if YOU the fans would just yell about not signing every free agent available. And the beat goes on.

hey Joe- were you watching when Brett Myers struck out Pena to clinch the East? didn't you notice Burrell standing on the top step of the dugout with bated breath? don't you realize that there was no iconic pitcher-and-catcher-celebrate-together moment because Pat Burrell came crashing into Myers long before Coste even made it to the mound...

i completely agree with you that Philly loves it's players who show some emotion. and that, in the past, Burrell has made himself a target for fan's ire by refusing that do that, but you cannot seriously still hold that opinion of him after last season! Pat Burrell was Mr. Championship Run. he was the first out to the mound when we clinched. he was the one asking for Rollins' 20th triple ball, so it could be saved for JRoll. he was the one doing cartwheels in front of Aaron Rowand's spectacular catch at the wall. he was, in that second half, a permanent fixture on the top step of the dugout.
Burrell is a flawed player, as they all are, and he definitely confounded me with his affectless appearance over the years, but one of the things i treasure most as a fan about our magical 2007 season was seeing Pat Burrell come alive.

Pat Burrell has had good years and terrible years with the Phillies. There is one picture of him I can't get out of my mind. Last year when he was struggling and watching the games from the bench he was always the first up to congratulate a teamate. He didn't appear to sit back and moan and act like he didn't care. That may not be worth a $50 million dollar contract but it is an intangible that goes a long way with his teamates and creates a positive winning environment. He's a good guy and I wish him the best this year and years that follow.

Truth: Pat been here for 9 years now. I think he's learned how to handle the fans.

Sam: So if he is that much a liability for half the year, why are the other pitchers pitching around him during that time? There are not a lot of power hitters who don't go cold for streches.

I think you need Pat for a year or two until you see if Greg Golson is going to make it or how Dominic Brown is progressing.

What is interesting is Baseball America's projected Phillies lineup of 2011:

Catcher Lou Marson
First Base Ryan Howard
Second Base Chase Utley
Third Base Travis Mattair
Shortstop Jimmy Rollins
Left Field Pat Burrell
Center Field Dominic Brown
Right Field Adrian Cardenas
No. 1 Starter Cole Hamels
No. 2 Starter Brett Myers
No. 3 Starter Carlos Carrasco
No. 4 Starter Joe Savery
No. 5 Starter Josh Outman
Closer Brad Lidge

Truth you are so f@cking pathetic! Your gonna tell me that YOU never booed Pat the bat? Not once? Gimme a f@cking break man!! I've always liked Pat, but I've booed him a few(hundred lol)times just like EVERY other Phillies fan. I havent done it, but Im sure if you compare his stats and salary with other outfielders, he may just be a bargain, old contract or not. I think he would take 6-7 million a year for 2-3 more years. Nobody is perfect out there in left, and I dont think Pat is that bad that a base runner will routinely take second or third on him and not any other guy out in left. Sure he may butcher a play here and there, who doesnt, nobody's perfect.

Lea and Keith, you both made good points about Pat. Nice to see a few fans stick up for him.

YOU the fans once again under analyze the situation. Pat responded in accordance last year during the stretch drive once YOU the PHILADELPHIA fans relaxed. He seemed to prosper. I booed him just like everyone else in '06, Clinton, NJ. He certainly looked like a deer in head lights and as a former athlete I have seen plenty of teammates tighten up due to FAN pressure. It is absolutely no coincidence that he prospered when cheered as opposed to shrinking when jeered by YOU... YOU the fans are part of problem and I'm encouraging you to be part of the solution. Any idiot can blog and say how great the team is going to be in Feb. It's how you the PHILADELPHIA FAN responds to the slumps and the losing streaks that makes or breaks the heart of the franchise/the players. How many Phillie players have complained about YOU. Wagner hated it here, and he's a highly intense guy. Your poster boy Brett "the wife beater" Myers complains about YOU all the time. Burrell has to. Rollins has too et al.
Acknowledge your roll thru out the season, not just when blogging in the off season.

Well Truth, to be fair, you are part of the fans and admitted to booing as well, so when you say "YOU", you really me "WE"..

There have been times in the past, even when Pat struggles, that he hasn't been treated that badly. Even though he's heard the boos plenty, he probably has gotten overall better treatment than a lot of other players who have come and gone from Philadelphia. There are players who have played here who no matter what they do, the fans don't like them, but that has never been the case with Pat - he has always been generally supported well.

Truth, you contradict yourself. You're looking for such a great argument but how can anyone argue with someone that contradicts themselves?

You forgot to ad "CLASSLESS" to your last post.

Enough already with that picture, some of us check your blog at work.

I am shocked here. Truth actually said something positive about the phillies. And even more shocking is that he is right. The fans get on burrel for no reason. Even if you compare his numbers with runners in scoring position to howard's in his MVP year they are comparable (a little worse but close).

Pat is the reason we made the playoffs last year. Without him we don't make it, most phillies fans don't want to believe that but when we lost the reigning MVP (howard) and the MVP front runner (utley) for a month at the same time....it was pat who not only kept us a float but was leading us to a division championship.

If he was a free agent from another team we would have signed him (for more money) and been ecstatic with his production. He is a guy that if he plays 130 games will hit .260 drive in over 100 walk over 100 strike out over 100 and hit about 30-40 homeruns

You have to look at Pat Burrell's lame duck situation from his perspective and that of his agent. He's not going to tack on a year or two at $7-$8 million. His agent will have to guess what he's worth on the free agent market. It's also hard for him to take a paycut with the Phillies.

So unless the Phils are prepared to sign Burrell for 3+ years with $10 miilion per year plus incentives, free agency is a more attractive alternative. It makes sense for both sides to play this out because the Phils are not going to make a long-term committment to Burrell with other contracts coming up (Howard, Myers, Hamels, etc).

I do agree that 2008 could be a career year for Pat.

Go Pat! Go Phils!

I've always been a Burrell supporter, which doesn't mean I haven't internally cussed him when he's been in a funk. I haven't booed, which I find in his case utterly obnoxious. A lot of you act like Burrell suddenly started to care last year, the fact is he's always cared. His teammates have always respected him because he's always put in the work.

The most disgusting thing I saw was a father teaching his son to boo Burrell early last season.

Why is it Pat Burrell was booed for not showing emotion, yet Gregg Jeffries was also booed for showing emotion? It's not emotion or effort or anything, it's looking for a reason why the team isn't winning.

I have certainly cursed Burrell my share of times, especially 2 years ago when he repeatedly looked at the 3rd strike in key AB's. But that was then. He did that a lot less last year. A LOT LESS. Yet, still he took abuse out in left field that no player should have to endure, certainly not at your home park. Of course, he started the year horribly.

And then he did something amazing. He sucked it up and played through it. If you watched rather than simply booed or jeered, you could see that he was a completely different player from June on. He stopped being a robot at the plate. He got on his horse (admittedly, a slow and hobbled horse) and went after balls in the outfield.

To sum it up, he showed heart and class. You could make a very strong argument for Burrell as the team MVP last year. Certainly, without his amazing turnaround we would not have won the division or made the playoffs.

That's good enough for me. Kick ass this year, Pat.

Yo Zo! What's with this High Cheese guy taking your spot on the home page? Get that garbage outtttta herrrre!

You can't get on fans for booing Burrell before July 1. He was awful. he couldn't hit. He couldn't run. July and August, he was great; I booed him but I'll admit he was one of the guys who carried this team while Utley went down.

Truth- if you want tog et on fans for booing during the year that is certainly your right. If you do that, however, then you have to acknowledge the role that the fans played in helping this team win during the September games at CBP. The athmosphere was electric.

One other thing- I remember the series last year in mid-September when the Phils were in St. Louis and Cardinal fans booed the Cards off the field, the year after the Cardinals won the world series. Let's not pretend we're the only city in the whole world that boos (though we are very good at it).

Thats right KMG, look at A-rod too. Those Skankee fans boo him when he's not hitting and he's the best hitter in the game!! Fans do not cheer guys when thay are playing bad, and they do not boo when they are doing well, obviously quite the opposite, its only natrual!!

I think we boo too easily. It's one thing to boo someone who's visibly dogging it, but Philly fans will boo a guy for 3 straight AB's and then give him a standing O if he hits a game winning HR. That's being hypocritical. Burrell has never dogged it here. He's one of the hardest working guys on the team.
No doubt the fans were a big part of the pennant chase, so why not see more of that all season and save the booing for the right situations.

I actually have to agree (mostly) with Truth. I'm not saying that Burrell or any player should not be booed, but I think that he still gets booed too much. I'm actually a little surprised that he says he wants to stay in Philly and seems honest about itHe's very streaky but if he can pull it together for a full year and continue to do so I would like to see the Phillies sign Burrell to a 2 or 3 year deal with an option year.

Count me as another phan who has booed Pat on occasion. But I have to agree, he gets booed way more often than he deserves. But that's a typical Phillies fan. We have to hate someone on all of our teams.

You have to give the guy some props. Wanting to stay, even though he knows he gets treated like dirt. Come to think of it, there were quite a few cheers for Pat coming from the stands towards the end of the season.

And speaking of that tee shirt.....I read on delawareonline, that it was Chase that had the tees made!

What's up with the picture?

If you didn't boo Pat Burrell at the beginning of last year, and during many periods in the year before, you either weren't watching the games, or you don't know baseball.

HE ABSOLUTELY DESERVED TO BE AND EARNED EVERY BOO HE REC'D. Frankly, he was given much more slack the year before last than most players receive.

With that being said, he turned it around when it counted, and deserves a ton of credit for that.

No question Pat led the way when Utley went down. He really stepped it up. And YES -- this guy does work hard and is a team player. Is it frustrating that he takes a called third strike in the clutch more than not? Sure. But when we needed him the most last year, he delivered.

And 30/100 from the right side of the plate isn't exactly falling off the shelves. I say if the Phils can work a deal, keep him for two more years until Golson or whoever else comes along is ready.

One other comment. What surprises me is for a guy who gets booed more than Kobe at a Sixers game, he NEVER rips the fans or the city -- EVER. You can question is so-called lack of emotion and his k's in the clutch...but the man has class. Have a great year Pat -- GO PHILS!!

Wow jrquixote, you think someone is going to give Pat 3+ years at 10 Mill per year + Big Bonuses?

I think Pat would start asking at that number, but I don't think anyone is going to give it to him.

I think Pat would take a 3 year 8 Million deal, which might be one more year than the Phils would want.

After next year if Pat is on the team he would have a automatic No-Trade right? (10 years, 5 with the same team)