The Zo Zone

Great minds think alike- http://pabaseball.blogspot.com/2008/02/arbitrationoh-no.html

Well, thank goodness this will finally be over. Is he worth 7M, sure. Will he be overpaid at 10M, no. Truthfully, I think the Philles won't be broken hearted either way.

Let's play ball!

If there was an expansion draft and you could protect two members of the Phillies (non-Pitchers), who would you keep? I would keep Rollins and Utley.

I think Howard is going to lose this one. If you call 7 Mil a year 'losing'. :-)

I read in the Inquirer this morning that of all the players who went to arbitration hearings, management won.

Either way, the team AND Ryan are winners.

Maybe they cut a deal, split the difference just before the hearing? What time is the hearing?

I'd lock up Utley and Hamels. I know Hamels is injury prone but he's a great pitcher and is only gonna get better. Howard is older and larger which means his conditioning will be a problem not to mention the problems he is liable to have with his legs. Rollins is also a bit old to save, not that I don't love the guy. I hope Howward has a great year but if he does the Phils better open up their checkbooks for him. No need to piss him off any further.

Great question Case. This ought to get the crew started on a heck of a debate.
I think Howard learned his lesson after last season on conditioning, I was impressed that he went to an pre-season "spa" to make sure he was in good shape this year. He's a quality guy, solid family, I think his work ethic is fine. I think he has more than a few great seasons left. has holes but what an upside.
Utley is a best pure hitter on team, better than average fielder, the kind of gamer that every team wants and needs. Possible MVP down the road. Wish he would be more of a leader, example is nice, but staying above the fray (anyone think of Mike Schmidt?) may not be as helpful.
Rollins is the leader, the guy that raises the bar for everyone and backs it up with talent. No holes in his game, bats, runs, throws, with the best of them.
All that being said, I think that Howard and Rollins are the guys (by a whisker), which is hard because Utley is my favorite. Besides Howard has great trade potential down the road if neccessary. But I certainly think other arguments are valid.

I think you could make an argument for any of the three. The only reason I would take Utley over Howard is that he is more likely to give you 162 games a year, and he's clutch. If there were key spot in the 9th inning of game we need to have, and I could have my choice of guys to be up at the plate, I would take Utley over anyone on the team. Although Howard has had his share of big hits in that spot. I would say Utley and Rollins would be my two, as you said Jimmymack, "by a whisker". Plus, I think Howard long term has AL DH written all over him, unfortunately. But we should be thankful that we don't need to make a choice because we have all three for a few years to come.

Utley/Rollins/Hamels all probably before Howard, epsecially if Hamels has a solid follow up year. Pitching and Defense I would value over power hitting.

PS, the Kendrick prank would have been even funnier if they ended it by really trading Eaton to friggin' Ukraine or anywhere!

jimmymack swings and misses-

-Chase is a potential MVP
jimmy we have two actual MVP's on this team

-Chase is the best pure hitter on the team
Maybe, but Rollins and Howard are far better clutch hitters and thats what matters.

-Chase is a "gamer"
Great, but you admit too timid to lead

-Chase has missed too much time over the last two years.

No question Howard gets a spot. How did the Red Sox do after they gave away the "Babe"?

If you ant to argue Rollins/Utley fine. I'd take the leadership and swagger of Rollins as oppossed to the timidity and "lead by example" or "gamerishness" of Utley..

Utley is already locked up, he signed a 7 year 85 million deal last year... but how are you gonna say Rollins is too old when he is the same age as Utley? People forget he is still just 29 because he has been around since 2000.

Truth honestly man what did whitey do to you?

Utley not clutch? For his career:

RISP: .302 avg, 24 HRs, 283 RBIs, .873 OPS, 597 ABs

RISP 2outs: .301avg, 11 HRs, 114 RBIs, .924 OPS, 239 ABs

Late and Close: .292 avg, 15 HRs, 75 RBIs, .920 OPS, 342 ABs

Now I love Rollins, he might be my favorite player on the team, but c'mon now why slander Utley to support Rollins? I don't buy that Chase is too timid to lead. Bobby Abreu was too timid to lead. Chase leads by his style of player, his hard nosed attitude which sets the tone for the rest of the team. Jimmy on the other hand is the more vocal, energetic leader, to each their own. I think its important to have both types of leadership on the team. But those 2 are the unquestioned leaders of the team and to suggest otherwise is incorrect.

I rarely post back to back but I really had to add; even by the "Zo Zone" blog standards those who posted so far saying they would not protect Howard are really short sighted and have quickly forgotten '06 and even last year for that matter...
I'd like to see Utley hit 2-3 homers in a game, or drive in 4-7 RBI's in a game 10-15 times a year.
Chase Utley is a social misfit. He fears the camera's. I mean he was in game 10 of the 35gm hit streak and stopped granting interviews to the press. He kind of sits around the dugout with this pseudo intense weirdo look. No offense to anyone but I think his wife is his beard, I wouldn't want to drop the soap....
I admit this has nothing to do with his play but it has to do with the intangibles when everything else is equal.

good debate. since we aren't counting pitchers, and we are talking about an expansion draft protection (meaning teams would look at pieces to build around - in general). i will also assume we are talking about protecting guys on the 25 man roster. i would say rollins and utley. main reasons for these two would be b/c they both play positions where they are a rarity (sp?). there are not many 2b with a good glove and a good bat. same goes for ss. and they are both under 30 yrs old. while you can't throw anybody at first and whoever they got would be a step back from howard, it is a little easier to find a 1b that can hit for power. it is still a tough call though.

Case, I'd take MVPs Howard and Rollins and cross my fingers that Utley wouldn't come back to haunt me.

Its a tossup, really. Fortunately, this isn't a choice the Phillies need to make.

the guys you keep are utley and rollins. And howard is probably the first pick in the expansion draft.

This is no knock on howard. Middle infielders that are average to above average defeneders and still put up good to great offensive numbers are harder to find then first baseman or outfielders who do the same.

Also if you look at runs produced (Runs + RBIs - HRs) over the last 3 years, utley beats howard.

and to preemptive strike against truth's racist rational. Weren't there 2 all-star 1B last year who made about a combine $1.2 million? Dimitri Young and Carlos Pena had great years..Maybe not at howard's 2006, but you won't find middle infielders in the scrap heap capable of putting up comparable numbers to Utley and Rollins.

-Rollins and Howard are far better clutch hitters and thats what matters.
see Chewey59

-Chase has missed too much time over the last two years.
Utley - 2006, 160 games; 2007, 132 games
Howard- 2006, 159 games; 2007, 144 games
11 more games than Howard, broken hand, not due to being out of shape with left quad strain

-I'd like to see Utley hit 2-3 homers in a game, or drive in 4-7 RBI's in a game 10-15 times a year.
Howard had 5 multi-home run games in 2007

-Chase Utley is a social misfit...this pseudo intense weirdo look....
mirror, mirror on the wall

-No offense to anyone ...
today is different than any other day?

-I admit this has nothing to do with...
any logical thought process

You are entertaining, in a Twilight Zone sort of way, I'll give you that.

We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.

Love the Twilight Zone reference, jimmymack! "Truth" is definitely entertaining!

And Truth.......

Get your facts straight when you're discussing your "arch nemesis", Chase Utley.

Chase didn't "stop granting interviews" during his hitting streak. He just preferred to talk about the team as a whole (as he always does) and not focus on himself. In fact, that whole scenario turned into a running gag. Ask Todd.

He also doesn't "fear the camera". It may not be his favorite thing in the world to do, but he's always there for the post-game media frenzy. (Sorry Todd!)

And haven't you ever heard his team-mates say, over & over, how Chase leads by example. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me!

I'll never forget a game on Fox last season. They had Michael Bourne introducing the line-up and he called Chase the teams "Quiet Crusader". Perfect discription!

Truth, your recent comments about Chase Utley make you out to be a homophobe and a racist. Go suck on Omar Minyana's Latino dick while you give your life savings to Ryan Howard.